Brian G Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 The water heater in our old mo-bile home is having a problem. It doesn't make enough hot water all of a sudden, or at least not as much as it did before (my daughter thinks this is a problem; SHOCK!). I tried checking continuity on both elements (electric), and both seemed fine. Both thermostats also seemed fine; when I turned them up I got the ole' *click* and they read good. That's about as far as my water heater testing knowledge goes, so I'm looking for input. Any suggestions? And no Les, it isn't the custom-made drip pan that's doing it. [:-cyclops Brian G. Whut It Iz? [:-boggled
caryseidner Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 A "hole less" X-gallon water heater will always produce X-gallons of heated water. Right? So how could it all of a sudden be producing a smaller quantity of hot water? Maybe it is all of a sudden producing X-gallons of cooler water. I'm guessing that would mean a bad thermostat if the heating elements tested fine.
charlieb Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 Originally posted by caryseidner A "hole less" X-gallon water heater will always produce X-gallons of heated water. Right? So how could it all of a sudden be producing a smaller quantity of hot water? Maybe it is all of a sudden producing X-gallons of cooler water. I'm guessing that would mean a bad thermostat. Broken dip tube (sudden) Is the upper thermostat sending power to the lower tstat? Maybe it just needs a better pan![:-party][:-party]
Terence McCann Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 Did you put an amp probe on the elements Brian?
AHI in AR Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 This is so simple, I'm sure you've considered it, but just in case... If the way you determined that the water heater isn't producing as much hot water as it used to is that you run out of hot water faster when showering, there may not really be anything wrong with the water heater. The incoming water that is being mixed with the hot water is colder at this time of the year, so it takes relatively more hot water per minute of usage to get the outlet temp you want at the shower or tub. Taking long showers in the summer: not a problem. Taking long showers in the middle of the winter: possibly a problem.
fqp25 Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 How old is the unit? Do you have hard water there? Frank
hausdok Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 Have you been flushing that puppy once a year? If not, the lower element might be immersed in crud and not heating as well. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike
kurt Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 Originally posted by hausdok Have you been flushing that puppy once a year? If not, the lower element might be immersed in crud and not heating as well. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike That was my knee jerk guess. You're on a well, right? How's your water?
Les Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 I'm with Mike O and Kurt. The element would test ok, but not heat or just sizzle. The ground water incoming remains constant (does everywhere else). Sometimes the upgraded drip pan will place a strain on the elements - ya know, make it go 90mi per hr! The dip tube would be number two guess. They are not showering every day, are they?
Jerry Simon Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 While we're at it...how about a gas water heater that doesn't now provide as much hot water as it used to? I know it ain't the dip tube. I know it ain't a sediment issue. That's all I know. I suspect the thermostat might be goofy in some way; but what type of goofy, or even if goofy, I isn't sure. Thanks for any help.
Gibsonguy Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 Does it get hot or only warm? Have you checked the dip tube?(For the electric tank) Corrosion of the heating elements is possible if the dip tube is eroded. Check the temperature of the hot water at the tap compared to the settings at the tank. How long is it before the water cools?.. and more importantly how long is it before the tank heats up again? An electric 50 gal tank should take 1 hr to heat from ground water temp. (I beleive gas fired tank should be 10-15 min. I have to check my notes on that as I seem to switch the gas and oil fired times up)
StevenT Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 Whenever I have to fix ANY type of machine, whether it be a water heater, boiler, commercial washing machine, etc., and I am having a problem figuring out what the problem is, I call the company and get help from their technical dept. They have yet to let me down, I can't think of any unnecessary parts that I have purchased, and I've saved a tremendous amount of time. Make sure you have a multimeter including an amprobe on hand. I don't tell them I am fixing my own item. They seem to frown on that and will recommend a technician. I simply tell them I am an inspector and am trying to figure out the problem.
Mark P Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 Originally posted by Les The ground water incoming remains constant (does everywhere else). Les, I've never measured it and have never researched it, but ... Every morning for years I have washed my face with cold water and I truely believe the water from the cold tap is much colder in the winter then it is in the summer. On a side note: I use cold water to remind me that many people in the world have no warm water or have no water in at all.
Les Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 Hey Mark, I suspect there are areas that will have a variation in temps. Here in Michigan we have 56degree incoming from wells that are 30' plus. Of course it may vary a degree or two, but mostly 56degrees. "city" water may be a degree of two warmer, but it usually is consistant. Jerry, have seen that condition several times and usually is the plastic sheath on the t-stat probe. If it is nicked or scarred during installation they don't last long. The other condition I have seen is the draft dirverter warped or scaled or out of place. Mark makes a good observation about potable water. Not long and we may be wringing our socks for a little taste!
homnspector Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 I hesitate to offer Brian any electrical advice but I agree with Terrance and others, continuity may not tell you if the element is heating. Try the amp meter.
AHI in AR Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 Les, I'm in Arkansas; Brian is in Mississippi. I would not be surprised if the depth that they are required to bury water lines isn't too much different from what we have here. For the record, I am on city water and always have been. Since our frost line is only about a foot deep, water lines may not be buried nearly as deeply as they are farther north. There's a definite seasonal variation in inlet temps. I can tell you that I can't come close to washing my hands with cold water comfortably in the winter. In the summer, the water borders on lukewarm. In fact, it's warm enough that I don't drink it without ice.
homnspector Posted January 17, 2009 Report Posted January 17, 2009 I had somebody tell me how to check the elements once. I think it was disconnect the power. Disconnect the wiring from the elements. Check the continuity between terminals (should be). Check for continuity between each terminal at the water heater tank (should be none).
hausdok Posted January 18, 2009 Report Posted January 18, 2009 Jerry, Check to make sure that spiral baffle inside the center flue pipe of the water heater is still there and hasn't completely eroded away. Those are supposed to slow down the gases as they rise up through the center of the water heater. Sometimes they just flake completely away. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike
Brian G Posted January 18, 2009 Author Report Posted January 18, 2009 Oy! Lots of ideas; thanks gentlemen. Let me see.... I didn't check the amperage, but I can do that tomorrow. I just ohmed the elements while disconnected. We don't have hard water, or much sediment to speak of. Water quality is very good here. I'm not on a well, and I've never flushed out a water heater in my life. When we took out the old unit, about 3 or 4 years ago, it had only some typical calcification on the elements and tank walls. I haven't checked the dip tube, so that could be it. Is there a simple way to check that, or do you have to remove it to see what's what? I'd have to take the whole thing out of a closet to do that. It isn't the seasonal change in ground temps. The kids have been through a few winters in that old house trailer; no problems until now. Incoming water is colder when the outside temps are colder here, but that comes and goes itself. We've had one ot two weeks of mid-60's at a time, but the hot water issue was no better for it. Thanks again for all the input. Lordy, please be an element, not a dip tube. [:-headach Brian G. What Dip Designed the Dip Tube Anyway? [:-irked]
charlieb Posted January 18, 2009 Report Posted January 18, 2009 Originally posted by Brian G Oy! Lots of ideas; thanks gentlemen. Let me see.... I didn't check the amperage, but I can do that tomorrow. I just ohmed the elements while disconnected. We don't have hard water, or much sediment to speak of. Water quality is very good here. I'm not on a well, and I've never flushed out a water heater in my life. When we took out the old unit, about 3 or 4 years ago, it had only some typical calcification on the elements and tank walls. I haven't checked the dip tube, so that could be it. Is there a simple way to check that, or do you have to remove it to see what's what? I'd have to take the whole thing out of a closet to do that. It isn't the seasonal change in ground temps. The kids have been through a few winters in that old house trailer; no problems until now. Incoming water is colder when the outside temps are colder here, but that comes and goes itself. We've had one ot two weeks of mid-60's at a time, but the hot water issue was no better for it. Thanks again for all the input. Lordy, please be an element, not a dip tube. [:-headach Brian G. What Dip Designed the Dip Tube Anyway? [:-irked] It won't be an element if it Ohmed out. It could be a thermostat. Reguarding the crud, did you look for a hard slug of it in the bottom of the tank? A dip who liked plenty of hot water. I still say it's the pan that is the real problem![][]
Terence McCann Posted January 18, 2009 Report Posted January 18, 2009 Just because the elements ohmed out does not mean there isn't a circuit problem. Could be a safety limit too. I've always liked to amp first when trouble shooting problems like these but that's just personal preference. If they don't amp out correctly use a volt meter to find the open circuit. If they amp out correctly then look for what the others have said.
Jeremy Posted January 18, 2009 Report Posted January 18, 2009 One thing about it, you can check the dip while you have the tank out for the high performance pan installation.
kurt Posted January 18, 2009 Report Posted January 18, 2009 Forget all this technical crap. Do something for the economy. Go out and buy a new water heater. No, wait, buy 2 or 3. Do it for America.
energy star Posted January 18, 2009 Report Posted January 18, 2009 Brian G, what was the prob? It's fixed by now, how are things?
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