Apollo HydroHeat -- known problems?

[Marc]

Ask the HOA manager for the code cite that was used to justify the need for that fan. Perhaps there are alternates to the fan. Sometimes a cite is applied where it doesn't belong.

Most likely there's some ventilation requirement because of the interaction between the heater and the environment it's within.

Marc

[rkenney]

What is this fan for? Bleeding off excess heat? A normal HW tank does not have such a fan.

Draft inducers were added when high effiency came into play. The gases from high efficiency heating equipment are not hot enough to create a good draft in a chimney. They designed the draft inducer to overcome this problem.

They help draft the combustion gases out of the heating appliance and up the chimney.

Without the inducer motor the heat would build up in the heating equipment and overheat which would cause the furnace or boiler to shut down on safety switches that are built in to the unit.

[hoosier inspector]

Thanks for the reply. The fan is not screeching; I have put my hand on it when it is running and do not feel and bad vibration either. The air intake is only 3-4 inches long and opens to the back of the closet...so the turbine sound appears to be coming from the fan simply drawing air at high speed (I can muffle it with my hand by closing it slightly). That is why I think I can muffle it in the closet by attaching a good length of 4 inch wide hose running into the bottom of the closet. But I cannot do the same for the exhaust end, though the long intake draw may tend to quiet it some as well.

What is this fan for? Bleeding off excess heat? A normal HW tank does not have such a fan.

How loud is it? Compared to a refrigerator? dishwasher? vacuum cleaner? Hair dryer? Some of these fans are fairly loud and are not so noticeable in a basement. In a closet next to a bedroom is a different story.

[onechosen1]

Thanks for all of the replies guys; I am learning allot from you. The fan is about as loud as a vacuum cleaner, albeit one with a BIG motor. I hope today to try to tie a few feet of 4 inch diameter hose to the intake and see how quiet that makes it; I just need to knock it down some and it will be fine...as is, the turbine sound almost echoes in the HW heater closet.

[ray62]

Own one in a 133 unit condo complex in '04. We all have the Apollo Hydroheater. The "heating system" is not on its own loop. In other words, the domestic hot water and the heating is on the same line. I been have told by professional plumbers this not to code.

One of the owners has already made a correction which cost her 6K, she now has a tankless system for hot water and a sperate boiler for her heat. When my system gives up I hope if will not cost that much.

Question: Can anyone think of a simpler less expensive solution?

[Tom Raymond]

Question: Can anyone think of a simpler less expensive solution?

Install another storage tank water heater to meet your domestic water needs.

I just replaced mine over the weekend for less than $400. Double that if you plan to hire a plumber.

[hausdok]

Replace the water heater with one that has an immersed coil for the hydronic system. use the water in the tank for domestic hot water. Connect a plate exchanger with circulator to the immersed loop in the tank and the apollo system, another circulator and an expansion tank to the other side of the plate exchanger. Now you have a closed loop for the heating system and all domestic hot water comes from the water in the tank.

This is an over-simplified explanation. Talk to a reputable HVAC guy about this suggestion. He'll be able to tell you what it will cost and what additional elements, if necessary, will need to be incorporated into the system. It may go over $6K one never knows.

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike

[ray62]

Thanks for the suggestions. This is 1300 sq.ft condo. The W/H is located on the poarch, the heat exchanger is in the middle of the unit. The W/H has one cold water line in, one hot water line out and one water line retuning from the heat exchanger. The domestic hot water line must be teed somewhere in the wall or ceiling ahead of the heat exchanger. To correct the problem and bring it up to code I will need to have two lines (in and out) from the exchanger to the W/H or boiler, I get that. However, I am not looking forward to ripping into sheetrock to add a new copper line.

Having said that, if I leave the existing configuration are there any safety or health reasons that I am missing?

[frustratedhomeowner]

Yet another homeowner from Durham with an Apollo problem.

Original Apollo unit, circa 89/90. slab foundation. Definitely has had efficiency issues for the two years we've lived here (a HVAC company was consulted, and ultimately, it was just a sales pitch).

Now our living room is wet because of a leak in the system that appears to have been going on for some time judging how wet the carpet padding is and far it goes.

is there, and where/what would a water shutoff valve look like for this system?

is there a DIY list of easy possibilities we could possibly fix on our own?

is this unit even worth fixing at this point? One of the returns doesn't even suck air at all (the upstairs one) and our peak AC and heat times have astronomical bills. no clear answer from previous HVAC evaluation that makes sense-- their suggestions were to basically try shots in the dark.

does someone have a recommendation for finding a credible HVAC specialist for this type of unit?

ugh.

[Marc]

Try this:

Do your best to find a reputable HVAC technician to look everything over. Agree on a fee for him to do this for you and make sure he understands that he will not be rewarded any repair/replacement contract as a result. You want his impartial expertise, that's all.

An alternative is to hire a crack home inspector to focus on the issues you're experiencing, all of them. You might be in Bruce Ramsey's service territory. Check him out on this forum.

Marc

[hausdok]

It's a 23 year old unit and it was designed to last about twenty years. Time to start looking for alternatives.

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike

[terryswhite]

i have an apollo hydro swirl unit in my aparment of about 700sf. how do I start the pilot? The pilot appears to be out, the water heater is cool to touch, and water at the sinks is tepid. Also, should i be concerned that all the lights on the control unit are lit?

[glightn]

First off - thanks to all of the professionals who are sharing their knowledge of Apollo systems. I have (2) Apollo 5010 units supplying heat and hot water for my townhome. One of the units will lose it's pilot light for no apparent reason. In the last month and a half it has gone out twice. The last time it was relit it remained so for about (2) weeks. Any suggestions for what may be happening? The only reason it is known is because heating and water are both affected if only half of the system is operating.

Thanks

[Robert Jones]

Sounds like a damaged/failing thermocouple. The only other thing I can think of is a ventilation issue.

[tsacilec]

Quote: Originally posted by AHI in AR

I just inspected a home with an Apollo HydroHeat system circa 1991. It was paired with a conventional electric A/C. Hydronic heat is really rare around here. I last saw one about 8-9 years ago as best I can recall. The unit takes water from the water heater adjacent to it and pumps it through a coil when in heating mode. The slightly cooled water is then recirculated back into the water heater tank.

Anyone have any info on typical problems or other cautions about these? I Google'd it and can't find much. The company's own site is pathetic.

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I've seen several of the Apollo systems. I think they're dandy. Two of the systems I've seen were brand new and were leaking. Look for leaks in the connections to the hot water coil in the air handler.

Other than that, the system seems to work very well and the occupants seem to like it.

- Jim Katen, Oregon

[Squeeealer]

A new issue... let me start from the beginning...

Two days ago the city did some work on my street and turned off the water. Once the water was turned back on we noticed a loss of water pressure. We asked the city to come back to check it out, but when they did they said that the pressure was fantastic. Since that time we've still noticed the pressure being not as good, even after the air in the pipes got worked out, but it's good enough.

Now the Apollo part of the story. Temps have been getting down in the 20's the past day or so and we noticed that the air blowing wasn't hot. The pilot light is on, the water is heating, and our hot water works just fine. So why is it blowing air that isn't warm?

Could the two parts of the story be related? They happened essentially at the same time.

[Marc]

Forget the air temps coming from the heating register for a minute and just tell me if the heater been able to keep the house at the temperature the t-stat is set to.

Marc

[Squeeealer]

No, last night it could not get up to the temp we set the thermostat to, and in fact, the temp was dropping.

I can't believe I left out this very important update from this morning. We turned off the heat overnight. In the morning, the temp was 52 and I turned on the heat. The air coming out was warm and it climbed to 55. Then we were worried that at some point it hits a wall of some kind, so we left it off all day and just turned it back on. It got up to the temperature we set it to and turned off.

So now it's magically working again apparently, but there's still the question of will it work all day or all night long. We shall see...

[Marc]

Perhaps a pocket of air hits the pump once in a while. The new water heater doesn't have a loop inside the new water heater does it, like Mike O suggested a while back?

Marc

[Garet]

A pocket of air in the heating coil inside the air handler would drastically reduce the amount of heat being transferred into the living space.

[lizharmony]

In 2006 I purchased a duplex (built in 1996) in which each unit has an Apollo Hydroheating system. In my unit I replaced the hot water tank with a Rinnai tankless and have had no problems until recently. I just replaced the upstairs hwh with a Rinnai after it gave way, and my tenants are thrilled with the performance. They no longer have to turn the heat off in order to take a shower. I never have had to with mine.

Jim Katen, you are amazing with all your help! Especially the Manual, which will be invaluable since the HVAC people in the area don't seem very familiar with the system. Unfortunately my printer gave out halfway through but I have the link saved.

I'll post again when I figure out my current problem - or explain it and see what people have to say.

[luannec]

We own a small investment property that we've been renting out for the last 10 years but now we've decided to sell it. The home has an Apollo 5010 water heater that provides heat and hot water. This house was built in 1992 and we're sure this is the original water heater so it's definitely served it's purpose. However, now it's leaking and we need to replace it. I'm looking for advice on what to replace it with. Since we're selling the house, we're looking for the most economical choice.

[luannec]

Oh, and I forgot to mention this. We cut off the water to the unit and drained it because it's started to leak. Now we don't have cold water in the house either. Any idea on why that would be?

[Jim Katen]

We own a small investment property that we've been renting out for the last 10 years but now we've decided to sell it. The home has an Apollo 5010 water heater that provides heat and hot water. This house was built in 1992 and we're sure this is the original water heater so it's definitely served it's purpose. However, now it's leaking and we need to replace it. I'm looking for advice on what to replace it with. Since we're selling the house, we're looking for the most economical choice.

State makes water heaters that perform well as replacements.

[Jim Katen]

Oh, and I forgot to mention this. We cut off the water to the unit and drained it because it's started to leak. Now we don't have cold water in the house either. Any idea on why that would be?

Are you sure that it's not just at the showers? Single handle shower valves have a pressure balancing feature. If there's no pressure on the hot side, they'll drop the pressure on the cold side to match - in effect giving you no water at the showers.