What is the purpose of these?

[mridgeelk]

These little pouches were in many locations. Are they some form of mousebane? There was a bottle of something called Sonna (sp) just inside the crawlspace.

Also, the foundation may have been engineered as there is a a great deal of paper void in place under the stem wall to isolate the structure from the soil yet the post was on the concrete pad placed directly on the soil. I told my client that it may not be proper and to have it evaluated by a soils specialist/engineer. I also have left a message with the building dept. to see if there any records on this home that would help clarify this situation.

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[AHI in AR]

Forgetting about anything else, the material in the little bag looks like vermiculite, at least as near as I can tell. Why it would be placed around the foundation is a mystery to me.

[Jesse]

What is a soils engineer going to do with that?

[mridgeelk]

My question involving a soils engineer is why the pad is on soil that is being avoided by the use of the paper filler under much of the foundation.

The picture here shows one of the pouches stuffed into a hole that looks like where mice have been.

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Originally posted by Jesse

What is a soils engineer going to do with that?

[Les]

it could be a mouse bait, but more likely just a goofy decsicant. sure looks like vermiculite. WARNING: inspector lore' I have seen vermiculite used as a carrier for DDT. Actually done it myself. and, no I did not taste it!

[Jesse]

Originally posted by mridgeelk

My question involving a soils engineer is why the pad is on soil that is being avoided by the use of the paper filler under much of the foundation.

The paper filler is avoiding the soil? I'm still not following.

[Jim Baird]

If you were in New Orleans I might guess it's something Voodoo related. Got my mojo workin' but it just won't work on you.

[mridgeelk]

I hope this picture helps explain. The sometimes extremely expansive soils in this area can be avoided by this design. I could not determine exactly, but this home may be supported by only 30-40 sq. ft. of concrete columns extending to a stable soil strata. The concrete on the right in the picture is one of those column portions. The piece of 2x8 form material should have been removed when the forms were stripped. The paper void is to the left. The white stuff on the ground is a patch of alkalai.

Originally posted by Jesse

Originally posted by mridgeelk

My question involving a soils engineer is why the pad is on soil that is being avoided by the use of the paper filler under much of the foundation.

The paper filler is avoiding the soil? I'm still not following.

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[Tom Raymond]

I still don't get it. If the soil is so unstable that the house needs to be constructed on caissons, why is there a perimeter stemwall? And how is paper fill supposed to carry it? Also, the support post in the last pic in your original post looks wrong in at least 3 different ways: too small, untreated wood, not anchored to the pier.

Tom

[hausdok]

Originally posted by Tom Raymond

I still don't get it. If the soil is so unstable that the house needs to be constructed on caissons, why is there a perimeter stemwall? And how is paper fill supposed to carry it? Also, the support post in the last pic in your original post looks wrong in at least 3 different ways: too small, untreated wood, not anchored to the pier.

Tom

I think he's referring to a grade beam on pier foundation. The piece of wood isn't a post, it's the remains of some concrete forms that was never stripped away. The paper thing puzzles me too; I think he's trying to say that they use paper there as a bond breaker/slip sheet so that the heaving soil can move up and down without taking the foundation with it.

This is all guesswork based only on what I've heard about Colorado building practices. I still have no idea what he's saying with that sentence and I doubt that a customer will.

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike

[Tom Raymond]

I think he's referring to a grade beam on pier foundation.

That makes sense, but, around here we would end the piers below the frost line, place the grade beam, and build stemwalls on top of that. The last one of these I worked on was 8' from the steel breakwall holding the lot back from Lake Erie.

The post that bothers me is the one built up from 2x4's under/around the girder in the last picture in the first post. It's creative, but I don't like it.

Tom

[mridgeelk]

I have never heard it called a grade beam on piers/caissons, but for the sake of this discussion let's call it that. The piers can be usually from 6 to 12 feet on center. The bearing (footprint)size of the piers varies also with each structure and the depth is usually not reliant on frost depth but how far it is to stable soil. The paper filler is exactly what Mike said. I spoke with the current building inspector today, he could not find any record of it being an engineered foundation. This foundation system may have been just a bad guess on how to construct it as the subfloors vary several inches in elevation. My clients decided against buying the home because of the movement evident and also the moisture issues that I have not mentioned. I built a home a few years ago that on one end the soil was expansive and the end was on soil that consolidation was a factor. It was to be built on a crawlspace but due to the varying conditions and a favorable soil strata at about seven feet it was constructed on a full basement for only slightly more than the engineerd foundation would have cost and also doubled the size of the home.

Originally posted by Tom Raymond

I think he's referring to a grade beam on pier foundation.

That makes sense, but, around here we would end the piers below the frost line, place the grade beam, and build stemwalls on top of that. The last one of these I worked on was 8' from the steel breakwall holding the lot back from Lake Erie.

The post that bothers me is the one built up from 2x4's under/around the girder in the last picture in the first post. It's creative, but I don't like it.

Tom

[hausdok]

Here's a sketch of what I was referring to - they're used where unstabile/expansive soils are common.

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OT - OF!!!

M.

[mridgeelk]

If a home was built on expansive soil using the sketch design there would most likely be some sort of void placed under the concrete beams. Another design to deal with some expansive soils is to overexcavate, as in the case I am familiar with, three feet and then compact class 6 roadbase back to the original elevation. A convential foundation was then constructed

Originally posted by hausdok

Here's a sketch of what I was referring to - they're used where unstabile/expansive soils are common.

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OT - OF!!!

M.