I will not kill your deal

[Darren]

Got this off of IN; what do these people think?

http://www.bulldoginspect.com/agent.php

[Les]

I do not know Steve and Leslie, but, if asked, would caution them about their site. I am not WJ or Bonnie and I am an expert regarding home inspections and the process.

I think I understand their perspective and have seen it attempted by several major national companies and it don't work.

They may be a very talented knowledgeable inspection operation. I don't get that notion from my reading on the website.

[Jesse]

wow

[Scottpat]

Oh my.

From their site

WE WILL NOT KILL YOUR DEAL

I know for a fact that You didn't achieve Your level of success in the tough world of Real Estate by working with unprofessional people (although you may know a couple). As a matter of fact, I'm certain that the Vendors on "The List" You recommend to Your Clients are an Asset to Your sales process, not a Liability.

And while we've never worked together, both You and Bulldog® Professional Inspection Services have at least one thing in common -- We're Both Winners.

For the last 4 years, Bulldog® Professional Inspection Service has served over 1,300 Kansas City home buyers and 99% of the Real Estate Agents we've served have been thrilled with the work we've done for them and their clients. As a matter of fact, many of the real estate agents and lenders that use us today started with us 4 years ago and 40% of our business comes directly from Prior Client Referrals.

And this is the tame part!

[hausdok]

So,

Do you folks really want to point thousands of folks at them by posting their link on TIJ and thus improve their search engine rating?

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike

[Les]

it is all about statistics - more business - more exposure - shorter time in business!

[Bain]

I was certain it was a joke when I was reading it.

[bulldoginspect]

Any questions please read this site.

[John Dirks Jr]

It's a shame when a business model depends on the ignorance of others. This is why I believe an informed public would be the best way to improve the reputation of the HI industry.

There are plenty of inspection companies out there that act like this but in a more discreet way. I thinks it's quite amazing how this one just blurts it out for the entire world to see.

But then again, if there was no this then would there be that? The negative definition of one, elevates the other. In a strange kind of way, I almost want to thank the shyster.

You get it?

[Les]

I can see clearly now.

[hausdok]

Nicely done site, I gotta give them credit for that.

I'm not going to say anything about the site's content; if I do, it'll only get me in trouble with the sponsors. [:-taped]

OT - OF!!!

M.

[Brian G]

Posted at IN by bulldoginspect

If I found a home that had foundation failure I would tell the client in a professional tone that "the foundation is seccumbing to the hydrostatic pressures of the ground on the other side and we have to call a structural engineer.

Would they have any clue what you just said, other than the last part? Nobody over here would spout that sort of techno-babble to a layman client.

It isn't a big deal they are usually pretty cheap and they will tell you exactly how it should be repaired".

Say what? A failed foundation that needs evaluation and a proscribed repair by an engineer is cheap, and no big deal? Are you serious? How about the repairs themselves? Would you also characterize that as "cheap and no big deal"? If something like this is no big deal, what would you say was a big deal?

Very simply put, this is what I mean by "I will not kill your deal".

We get it, and we can't possibly miss the odor connected to what you mean. Your web page is an enormous embarrassment. Even faced with a lot of crummy, non-professional competitors, I can't imagine anyone I respect in this business going off in the deep end of the realtor-hugging pool the way you do. You flat-out promise to make their deals work, with no mention of reservations about doing your job as a paid professional supposedly working for your client. Disgusting.

Brian G.

I Need a Shower [:-crazy]

[bulldoginspect]

Thanks for your post, Brian.

You've just confirmed that this topic is not one that can be satisfied within this board and some of you are so threatened by me that no response will satisfy you.

In this industry, we walk a fine line between closer-friendly and alarmist and I happen to know that I've mastered that walk (visit http://activerain.com/bulldoginspect for testimonials to prove).

So if you're not a people person then maybe you should read a few books on the subject (I've also got a recommended reading page on my website that you can visit for some advice) or find a job as a high school night janitor.

And also let me tell you since you seem to have been sick the day they taught marketing in home inspection training...this is a relationship business...whether you like it or not.

Oh, and the last time I looked this is also a business.

So who in the world ever made it a sin to develop relationships with real estate agents for their referrals? Narrow minded and risk averse idealists like you who will go to your grave believing that you're doing something noble for the industry by denying the deserving clients of real estate agents the opportunity to work with you.

Then send them to me, I'll take care of them. Honestly, though, I think that attitude of shunning real estate agents as referral sources is an embarrassment for our industry. Why? Because it shows how unprofessional and backwards we are. I mean, why would anyone ostracize someone who can help put food on their table simply because they work opposite their client and they want to make a ridiculous point? Someone who needs a serious injection of confidence in their technical skills or in their people skills...or both.

A smart inspector understands their role well enough to deliver the information thoroughly, professionally, objectively and without downplaying the severity of an item, but still understands the scope of the home well enough to understand that everything can be fixed if the client is willing and able.

So is something ever a big deal? Maybe...maybe not. It's not for me to decide. I'm just there to connect with my clients on a personal level (I do love referrals, you know) while delivering objective information so they can make that decision for themselves. It's all about clear and open communication (which I happen to excel in).

Telling my clients that they need to call an engineer doesn't have to be scary for them (hence, not a big deal). It's just a simple phone call to a subject matter expert that will tell them the scope of a repair so they can take it to the contractor for a bid. So is it a big deal now? It's still up to the clients to decide.

If you're an alarmist, then this whole thing is scary and a big deal for you...if you're a professional, then this is a part of the job that you'll just take in stride.

I have no fear of ever compromising my integrity, my loyalty to my buyers/sellers/investors, or the respect and appreciation of my referral sources (lenders, agents, attorneys, insurance agents, family, friends, etc.).

So if you're not professional enough to build relationships with the many hard working real estate professionals who can send you business, don't knock me because I am. I understand the message my client's need to hear and I have the nerve to deliver it. I have 4 entrances on my website for 4 different types of clients and each has a specific message they care about. I've listened...maybe you need to, too.

God gave us 2 ears and 1 mouth for a reason.

That's it for my soapbox...i've got an inspection report to complete.

[Brian G]

Originally posted by bulldoginspect

Thanks for your post, Brian.

Ditto for yours. It's a gold mine of rationalization techniques and veiled insults.

You've just confirmed that this topic is not one that can be satisfied within this board and some of you are so threatened by me that no response will satisfy you.

You're confusing "threatened" with "disgusted by".

In this industry, we walk a fine line between closer-friendly and alarmist and I happen to know that I've mastered that walk (visit http://activerain.com/bulldoginspect for proof).

Rationalization #1. It's a Fine Line

I don't find much of a fine line at all. One does the job right, strictly for the client, and doesn't worry about where the chips fall as a result. What's so "fine" about that line?

So if you're not a people person then maybe you should read a few books on the subject (I've also got a recommended reading page on my website that you can visit for some advice) or find a job as a high school night janitor.

Tisk, tisk. Isn't this just the sort of name-calling you decried on the other website? You won't convince anyone who knows me that I'm lousy with people, here or elsewhere.

And also let me tell you since you seem to have been sick the day they taught marketing in home inspection training...this is a relationship business...whether you like it or not.

Rationalization #2. It's a Relationship Business

By which you really mean "with realtors", much moreso than clients. Marketing to realtors as the guy who absolutely will not break thier deal is repugnant, and is a clear and direct conflict with your supposed commttment to the client. You can't have it both ways. Lots of guys market well without going a mile over that line; why must you?

Oh, and the last time I looked this is also a business.

Rationalization 2B. We Gotta Make Money

Well sure we do, but what are we willing to do for it? Are we willing to sellout the people who actually pay us for the interests of those who can send more "payers" our way? Is doing business that way okay so long as you succeed? Nope.

So who in the world ever made it a sin to develop relationships with real estate agents for their referrals?

Nobody did, unless it involves compromising your obligation to your client. Vowing to never break thier deals does that, right on its naked face.

Narrow minded and risk averse idealists like you who will go to your grave believing that you're doing something noble for the industry by denying the deserving clients of real estate agents the opportunity to work with you.

I deny no one the opportunity to work with me, unless they want me to bow down. Do you presume I turn away clients who have realtors representing them? No way. I just do the job the same as always, no matter how things wash out for the agents. I'm not supposed to care if the deal works, so I don't.

Then send them to me, I'll take care of them.

Yeah. I'll do that.

Honestly, though, I think that attitude of shunning real estate agents as referral sources is an embarrassment for our industry. Why? Because it shows how unprofessional and backwards we are.

I know of only a few people who might actually shun a referral from a realtor. I know a great many more who would shun a crooked agent though.

I mean, why would anyone ostracize someone who can help put food on their table simply because they work opposite their client and they want to make a ridiculous point?

I'm not sure how you meant "work opposite their client", but I can't help thinking "Freudian slip" here. Like home inspectors, far too many agents are not out there putting the best interests of the client first. Thankfully, some are. I would ostracize someone who was willing to sell out their clients, without a moments hesitation. The "ridiculous point" I would be trying to make would be that I don't choose to associate with unethical agents. Silly me.

Someone who needs a serious injection of confidence in their technical skills or in their people skills...or both.

Ouch. I am wounded by your clever insight. Woe is me.

A smart inspector understands their role well enough to deliver the information thoroughly, professionally, objectively and without downplaying the severity of an item, but still understands the scope of the home well enough to understand that everything can be fixed if the client is willing and able.

Rationalization #3. Everything Can be Fixed if the Client is Willing and Able

So I guess no POS is bad enough that a client should just move on? Not that I would expect you to directly advise them that way, I don't, but the results of a solid inspection on a true POS is all a smart client ever needs to see the writing on the wall. Everything CAN be fixed, but sometimes a bulldozer is actually more cost-effective.

I love this part: "and without downplaying the severity of an item". Where is that mentioned on your realtor page?

So is something ever a big deal? Maybe...maybe not. It's not for me to decide.

Gentlemen, I rest my case.

I'm just there to connect with my clients on a personal level (I do love referrals, you know) while delivering objective information so they can make that decision for themselves. It's all about clear and open communication (which I happen to excel in).

You seem to feel that putting all issues on the same level equals being objective. It doesn't. The little things should be portrayed as such, and the big things should be given the greater weight they deserve.

And that "clear and open communication" your clients use to make decisions, does that include the kind of double-talk gibberish I cited earlier?

Telling my clients that they need to call an engineer doesn't have to be scary for them (hence, not a big deal). It's just a simple phone call to a subject matter expert that will tell them the scope of a repair so they can take it to the contractor for a bid. So is it a big deal now? It's still up to the clients to decide.

Rationalization #4. It's Up to the Clients to Decide What's a Big Deal

Funny, when I tell clients they need an engineer it's because I'm kinda scared for them. How can they reasonably judge which issues are and are not a big deal if you're smoothing all the big stuff over? In the end, yes, they have to decide what really matters, but without a pro to help them put things in the correct perspective they're still guessing.

If you're an alarmist, then this whole thing is scary and a big deal for you...if you're a professional, then this is a part of the job that you'll just take in stride.

If you run across something that's a big deal, flat-out saying so does not make you an alarmist.

I have no fear of ever compromising my integrity, my loyalty to my buyers/sellers/investors, or the respect and appreciation of my referral sources (lenders, agents, attorneys, insurance agents, family, friends, etc.).

Obviously.

So if you're not professional enough to build relationships with the many hard working real estate professionals who can send you business, don't knock me because I am.

Do I hear violins?

I understand the message my client's need to hear and I have the nerve to deliver it. I have 4 entrances on my website for 4 different types of clients and each has a specific message they care about.

Once again, I rest my case. You tell each group what they want to hear. How can an honest, ethical professional have conflicting messages for the world he works in?

I've listened...maybe you need to, too.

To the sound of a cash register, I presume.

God gave us 2 ears and 1 mouth for a reason.

You have this from him personally, do you?

That's it for my soapbox...i've got an inspection report to complete.

Yeah, 1600 items in about 2 1/2 hours isn't it? Do you wear skates, like the kids working at Sonic?

Wanna persuade your fellow HI's you aren't the suck-up you appear to be? Post a report, a real one with the name and address changed. We know quality work when we see it.

Brian G.

It Walks Like a Duck, It Quacks Like a Duck.... [:-yuck]

[jon_ran]

Originally posted by hausdok

Nicely done site, I gotta give them credit for that.

It is a very nice site. But, no matter how much icing you put on a turd, it still leaves a bad taste in your mouth![:-crazy][:-crazy]

I second the vote to post an actual report without the personal info to allow others to view and comment on. I spend 4 hours at a newer home with almost no issues, so I really can't visualize quality inspections on a home with issues in 2 1/2 hours.

[Darren]

Originally posted by bulldoginspect

So is something ever a big deal? Maybe...maybe not.

Telling my clients that they need to call an engineer doesn't have to be scary for them (hence, not a big deal). It's just a simple phone call to a subject matter expert that will tell them the scope of a repair so they can take it to the contractor for a bid. So is it a big deal now? It's still up to the clients to decide.

If you're an alarmist, then this whole thing is scary and a big deal for you...if you're a professional, then this is a part of the job that you'll just take in stride.

The last three times I have called for a structural engineer to review a problem on my inspections, he has offered the following estimates for repairs:

30,000-60,000

25,000-40,000

25,000-30,000

Maybe it's just me but somehow, I think that classifies as a BIG DEAL.

Bulldog, your website give the impression of a soft report. If ever you get sued, all a judge has to do is look at that page and you're toast.

So, if, as you say, you conduct (in my words) an unbiased view of the house, why do you promote yourself otherwise and risk getting creamed in court?

[Les]

I agree with Darren, Jon and Brian.

I know them.

Only a Fool would question Brian G's people skills. Or his integrity!

You all know what the report looks like. Why bother.

[Phillip]

Bulldog,

I can not believe that any inspector doing a proper job has not killed a deal.

Even the speed demon in my area that the Realtors love has killed a deal.

I report what I find. Talk to my clients and tell them what is going on with the house and what they may be having to deal with down the road.

I agree with the statements that Brain G. has posted.

Show us a real report. We all would be glad to post one.

[Steven Hockstein]

I forgot who wrote this first, otherwise I would give them the credit for this, but I love it:

"I never kill a deal, the house commits suicide"

This thread makes me feel like I am watching an episode of Cops and the scrappy suspect is surrounded by a bunch of muscular cops that will not let him get away. The viewers know who is right and who is wrong.

"Bad Boy, Bad Boy, What you gonna do...."

[Inspectorjoe]

Steve:

You have a very nice web site. It's got quite a bit of content on it and I see that you take pains to prevent unauthorized use. When I right-clicked to open a page in a new window, I got this:

Image Insert:

116.64 KB

What a clever idea.

That's a partial screen shot of your FAQ page, Ask Mack. Hmm, Mack, Bulldog ..... I'm surprised that Mack Trucks doesn't have a problem with that. That company has been around a long time. I'd guess that they take trademark infringement very seriously. But I digress.

I can't help but notice that item #25 on that page, The Final word: If Things Go Wrong After The Inspection, is just about word for word, the text from Carson-Dunlop's When Things Go Wrong page.

The Final word: If Things Go Wrong After The Inspection

There may come a time when you discover something wrong with the house you purchased, and you may be upset or disappointed with your home inspection. There are some things we'd like you to keep in mind.

Intermittent Or Concealed Problems:

Some problems can only be discovered by living in a house. They cannot be discovered during the few hours of a home inspection. For example, some shower stalls leak when people are in the shower, but do not leak when you simply turn on the tap. Some roofs and basements only leak when specific conditions exist. Some problems will only be discovered when carpets are lifted, furniture is moved or finishes are removed.

No Clues:

These problems may have existed at the time of the inspection, but there were no clues as to their existence. Our inspections are based on the past performance of the house. If there are no clues of a past problem, it is unfair to assume we should foresee a future problem.

We Always Miss Some Minor Things:

Some say we are inconsistent because our reports identify some minor problems, but not others. The minor problems that are identified were discovered while looking for more significant problems. We note them simply as a courtesy. The intent of the inspection is not to find the $200 problems; it is to find the $2,000 problems. These are the things that affect people's decisions to purchase.

Contractor's Advice:

A common source of dissatisfaction with home inspectors comes from comments made by contractors. Contractor's opinions often differ from ours. Don't be surprised when three roofers all say the roof needs replacement, when we said that the roof would last a few more years with some minor repairs.

Last Man In Theory:

While our advice represents the most prudent thing to do, many contractors are reluctant to undertake these repairs. This is because of the last man in theory. The contractor fears that if he is the last person to work on the roof, he will get blamed if the roof leaks, regardless of whether or not the roof leak is his fault. Consequently, he won't want to do a minor repair with high liability, when he could re-roof the entire house for more money and reduce the likelihood of a callback. This is understandable.

Most Recent Advice Is Best:

There is more to the last man in theory. It suggests that it is human nature for homeowners to believe the last bit of expert advice they receive, even if it is contrary to previous advice.

As home inspectors, we unfortunately find ourselves in the position of first man in and consequently it is our advice that is often disbelieved.

Why Didn't We See It?

Contractors often say, I can't believe you had this house inspected, and the inspector didn't find this problem. There are several reasons for these apparent oversights:

Most Contractors Have No Clue What's Inside or Outside The Scope Of A Standard Home Inspection: All of our inspections are conducted in accordance with the Standards of Practice of The American Society of Home Inspectors. The Standards of Practice specifically state what's included and excluded from the standard home inspection.

Most contractors have no clue this document exists and many of them have a tendency to &blame the Home Inspector& for any issue found, regardless of whether the issue is within the &scope& of the standard home inspection.

Conditions During The Inspection: It is difficult for homeowners to remember the circumstances in the house at the time of the inspection. Homeowners seldom remember that it was snowing, there was storage everywhere or that the furnace could not be turned on because the air conditioning was operating, etc. It's impossible for contractors to know what the circumstances were when the inspection was performed.

The Wisdom Of Hindsight: When the problem manifests itself, it is very easy to have 20/20 hindsight. Anybody can say that the basement is wet when there is 2 feet of water on the floor. Predicting the problem is a different story.

A Long Look: If we spent half an hour under the kitchen sink or 45 minutes disassembling the furnace, we'd find more problems, too. Unfortunately, the inspection would take several days and would cost considerably more.

We're Generalists: We are generalists; we are not specialists. The heating contractor may indeed have more heating expertise than we do. This is because we are expected to have heating expertise and plumbing expertise, structural expertise, electrical expertise, etc.

An Invasive Look: Problems often become apparent when carpets or plaster are removed, when fixtures or cabinets are pulled out, and so on. A home inspection is a visual examination. We don't perform invasive or destructive tests.

Not Insurance: In conclusion, a home inspection is designed to better your odds of not purchasing a "money pit". It is not designed to eliminate all risk. For that reason, a home inspection should not be considered an insurance policy. The premium that an insurance company would have to charge for a policy with no deductible, no limit and an indefinite policy period would be considerably more than the fee we charge. It would also not include the value added by the inspection.

We Hope This Is Food For Thought!

When Things Go Wrong

Now don't get me wrong, Steve. I have no doubt that you're an ethical and upstanding guy. It was probably just an oversight, but I didn't see anything on your page crediting Carson-Dunlop for that content. They do of course have a copyright notice at the bottom of their page: Contents of this site Copyright 2004 Carson, Dunlop & Associates Ltd. All rights reserved. No text or graphical material may be

copied from this site without the express written permission of Carson, Dunlop & Associates Ltd.

I would think that you'd have a little blurb on your page saying something along the lines of Used by permission, blah, blah blah.

Again, I'm sure it was just an oversight, but you might want to put that little blurb in there, to avoid any misunderstanding about whether you obtained permission. After all, you of all people know that "It's a bad thing to copy someone else's work.

[kurt]

Wow.

Steve's been doing HI's for 4 years. He's serviced 1400 folks. He's thrilled dozens of realtors.

If memory serves, that's right about the time the learning curve tightens.

I say we respect the marketplace, and let our new friend tell us all how it worked out 5 years from now.

Personally, I'm a little surprised that anyone is flogging a business model that's been proven in multiple courts of law to be a (big) loser. Couple that w/plagiarism, and there's more than a few kegs of dynamites (w/time delay fuses) our friend has planted around his feet.

And, Brian, I love you, man..........[:-thumbu]

[bulldoginspect]

Guys,

Leave it alone. I'm not going to continue to perpetuate this argument. You don't understand my message and I don't care if you do (you aren't my intended audience). Until you do, however, you'll continue to find yourself up against enlightened inspectors like myself who understand their role and deliver an excellent product.

So be the professionals you claim that you are and go figure out where your time is best spent because I hope it's not here bothering me and trying to make yourselves feel better by picking apart about my website...the message isn't changing and the site's not going away.

But I hope you do...

By the way, thanks inspectorjoe for the #25 insight from Carson Dunlop (they're actually the firm I got trained through). I got that bit of information from Ken Compton and it was never mentioned that he got it anywhere else...i'll definitely give the credit where credit is due.

And if you want to see a sample report, go to http://www.activerain.com/bulldoginspect

[kurt]

I had to look, but the site said File Not Found. Is there another way to see a report?

This is all rather breathtaking.

I'd be interested in Steve's take on Housemaster v. Herner.

Steve, have you looked into that?

[hausdok]

Originally posted by Steven Hockstein

I forgot who wrote this first, otherwise I would give them the credit for this, but I love it:

"I never kill a deal, the house commits suicide"

Our late, great, and very beloved AC and Pools Moderator, Norm Sage.

We miss you Norm.

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike

[allspec33351]

http://www.homegauge.com/report/437706/

mlc