Water key

[sepefrio]

I have been asked like 4 times in the last two weeks if I had a water key. I was told my, well I think everyone, I should NEVER turn on the water (especially at a foreclosure) because you have no clue what is hooked up and what isn't. Further if I did turn it on I could be found liable. What do you guys think? How do you answer these questions? I need work thats true, but I don't need headaches.

BTW, tomorrow morning I'm gonna call my insurance guy and ask them if I'm covered for that. A house I'm doing Monday, the Realtor says they have the sellers permission, but what is funny, the seller is the bank?

[Jim Katen]

Reminds me of the time I pulled up to an inspection and the realtor came running out of the house screaming, "Towels! Do you have any towels?!!"

I said, "Sure" and handed her a whole armload. She went running back inside with them.

Guess why?

- Jim Katen, Oregon

[StevenT]

I never open water mains, gas valves (or any other valves other than normal operating valves) that are shut, circuit breakers that are off, or doors that are locked. If someone else wants to, I don't care.

Imagine opening a water main, only to find out twenty minutes later that there is a broken pipe at the oppisite end of the building.

[davidlord]

I turn them on all the time. Alot of forclosures in this area rith now and when you get to them there is a sign on the door that says this house has been winterized (which is kinda funny like its gonna freeze or something). If the water's not on I can't do my job which means I'll be coming back to do something I could have already done.

The majority of these houses also have all the circuit breakers turned off. I switch those on also.

IMHO I think you can take the "if its shut off I'm not touching it" to the extreme. What's next if the front doors not open I'm not going in?

I don't know how this profession evolved into this state of disclaimers, CYA inspection agreements, and reports that don't really say anything. Pretty soon it's gonna be hard to prove some folks were even there.

[Les]

David has been around for quite some time and I am sure that works for him in Florida. I don't think it is a CYA issue here in wonderful mid-Michigan. It is just plain common sense for us to not turn the water on. Likely 90% of the "winterized" houses in our area are improperly done. We have found the leak can be discovered several days or weeks after the water is turned on. I have NEVER seen a house with hydronic heat properly winterized.

I have no problem with the protocols of any other inspector, however if it required a "key" to turn the water on, then I don't think I'd do it.

I would like to think this company is the least CYA inspection company in Michigan. I would also like to think we are the most knowledgeable and have good common sense. It ain't my house and never will be my house.

Gary,

I came back to this post after reading it and am refusing to change the first paragraph! (Bonnie hasn't been around for awhile and Walter must be on Grand Cayman.)

[Chris Bernhardt]

I will turn them on with permission on occasion but not without checking the plumbing first and being very cautious to watch the plumbing after I turned it back on. I always shut it off after I am done.

Otherwise if the water is off and we can't get permission from the selling side I don't turn them on even at the insistence of the realtor.

Chris, Oregon

[Scottpat]

In my city it is illegal to turn the water on at the meter if it has been turned off by the city or if the service is not active. The fine, if you are caught is $200. I always tell my client that if the water is not on, they need to have it turned on or I can't inspect the plumbing. Same goes for the gas, etc.

I also let everyone know that if the house is Winterized, they will need to have it Re-Winterized after we are done.

[sepefrio]

Well I spoke to my insurance company and here was the reply...

The insurance you have with us would cover you but we as well as any other insurance company would drop your coverage. Never cut on a system that has been winterized or cut off by utilities.

I told the Realtor and she is trying to get a written waiver of liability, otherwise we are going to reschedule.

Scott, you brought up a good point about it being legal, I guess my next call is to the utility company, thanks!

[Brian G]

I do it once in a long while, when circumstances warrant it. It certainly isn't something I would do routinely.

Maybe it's a regional thing, but they call that a "meter key" down here.

Brian G.

To Each His Own [:-alien]

[StevenT]

When John mentioned "meter key", I wasn't even thinking that the utilities were shut off. Maybe because I would never even consider jumping or overriding the shut off. Why should I?

In my mind I understood that the water was shut off at the main... no lock. In which case, I assume that it's shut off for a reason. Maybe it's CYA, maybe I just don't feel like buying someone's carpet or maybe I just don't feel like cleaning up a mess.

I have looked at a number of houses that had the utilities shut off. I still find more than enough to inspect that will give my client pleanty of information regarding the condition of the building.

When booking the inspection, I ask if the utilities are on. I let my client know that if they are not, there will be certain things that I will not be able to inspect. If I am told that they are on, and when I get there they aren't... I have no guilt feelings and simply include it in my report.

I also urge my client to have the homeowner or agent present. If for no other reason than to answer questions about the house, or turn on a breaker, etc. Although I may reset a tripped breaker, I will not turn one on that is off.

CYA??? O.K.

Now I admit that there was once a very special situation where the doors were locked and the keys my client had did not work. Besides the fact that the client was a very special person to me, the home was an abandoned foreclosure that had been ransaked. I still considered that I could get arrested, but I considered the situation and the person I was doing it for, and decided to take the risk.

But David, if the front door is not open, is it really your SOP to still go in?

[davidlord]

Calm down fellas nothing personal here. When I show up at a house I'm there to inspect it. Several people already know I will be there and they know why I'm coming. I'm talking about vacant houses. When I show up at a vacant house I either have the key or the lockbox code or there is a Realtor there to unlock the door. Obviously I don't break into peoples houses. Although I have gone in through unlocked windows before.

I understand things are different in various parts of the country due to weather and such. When I do turn the water on it's only after I have been through the house making sure all the faucets are off and theres no sign of a problem.

[Les]

David,

My comment was a feeble attempt to illustrate, to the youngsters, that different regions have different protocols and the old farts kinda know what will work. Shoot, Brian G knows his area much better than me.

Up here all you need is a 12" cresent wrench to turn the water on at the inside main. Complete shut down means pull the meter from the inside.

[Jack Ahern]

My father was a licensed master plumber and boasted once that he had a water key. I never saw him use it but I did fetch it once for him from the garage. Around here opening up the water valve in the street is the domain of the town "water and sewer dept."

Out in the Boonies, it might be OK to mess with the town water supply. Not me! We still have the key, but won't use it even for relatives. Still slow in my area![:-banghea

[sepefrio]

Well I never got to use it, even with the a letter waiving liability. They stopped the inspection when I found crumbling bricks in the fireplace. About a dozen full bricks had actually already fallen out.