PermaFlow P-Trap

[hausdok]

Has anyone seen one of these yet.

OT - OF!!!

M.

[n/a30]

It is a good idea, but it probably costs more than some builders would want to pay without passing the cost along. They could use it as a sales feature to show that the builder is thinking about their buyer and trying to add features and quality into their final product.

I see good products advertised and promoted all the time in Popular Mechanics / Popular Science and other similar magazines but few new products make it to shelves of hardware stores.

Marketing these new items is very expensive.

[kurt]

Looks smart, but seems kind of unnecessary. A conventional trap can be opened in 1 minute w/the existing compression fittings; when it's plastic, you can even do it by hand & forgo the channelocks.

Clean it out, put it back together. Most of the crud hangs up on the pop-up stopper mechanism anyway, not in the trap.

[fqp25]

I can see something like that for commercial applications, but residential I think it's a waste of money. How much will the average home owner bend down to adjust the velocity of their drain? Actually I guess it would be practical for the family that tends to drop things in kitchen drain.

I use to do a lot of service calls, and over 90 percent of the time, the blockage was beyond the P-Trap. Shampoo & toothpaste caps would usually make it past the trap and get lodged in the tee in the wall.

Even in tubs, the blockage was usually at the drain basket, or at the Drain & Overflow Tee, especially when, it was a plunger, or trip toe type stopper.

[Brad Manor]

I do, however, see a lot of those flexi-trap things held on with hose clamps. Usually a pretty good indicator that there will be some "homeowner ingenuity" throughout the house.

-Brad

[hausdok]

Originally posted by Brad Manor

I do, however, see a lot of those flexi-trap things held on with hose clamps. Usually a pretty good indicator that there will be some "homeowner ingenuity" throughout the house.

-Brad

Yeah, but let's not go there, Brad. Those have been discussed plenty of times in other threads. I was just wondering if anyone had seen any of these yet or are they still too new. In any event, I can see some buyer asking me one day whether the things work or not or are a violation some plumbing code.

OT - OF!!!

M.

[kurt]

I read somewhere that there are over 10,000 new products & services introduced into the building industry every year. This is one of those things.

Of the 10,000, approx. 3 make it past 18 months. We'll see if this trap is around 5 years from now. I'm betting not.

Interesting, though.

[Eric B]

This was as close as I've seen.

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[Jim Katen]

Originally posted by hausdok

Has anyone seen one of these yet.

OT - OF!!!

M.

It's a solution looking for a problem.

- Jim Katen, Oregon

[kurt]

I think they should make see thru toilets.

[Brian G]

I have to agree with Kurt's comments. I clean my wife's side of the double vanity out a time or two per year, and that device wouldn't help. It's always hair and gunk that's clinging to the hair, primarily at the stopper mechanism and just after the trap. That wheel thingy ain't gonna move hair anyway...it'll just wrap around it. I stick a pan under the trap, take the PVC pieces apart (no tools), clean out, and put it all back together in about 10 minutes. The amazing part is that the PVC pieces never leak afterward; fabulous.

Brian G.

NEXT! [:-bigmout

[hausdok]

Hi Brian,

I agree with you and Kurt - it is easy. However, most of the traps I see use slip rings that almost never get installed correctly by do-it-yourselfers. I find them leaking so often when installed by folks that think they're competent, I have to wonder if the average homeowner could do it without screwing it up.

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike

[fqp25]

Speaking of new drains, has anyone seen something like this. It is suppose to warm up the cold water supply with the warm waste water.

Download Attachment: Drain1.pdf

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(Now I know the Patent is dated in the early 80's, but I was wondering if anyone has seen one of these, or similar installed anywhere.)

Frank

[Jim Katen]

Originally posted by fqp25

Speaking of new drains, has anyone seen something like this. It is suppose to warm up the cold water supply with the warm waste water.

(Now I know the Patent is dated in the early 80's, but I was wondering if anyone has seen one of these, or similar installed anywhere.)

Frank

I've never seen one installed anywhere. But I remember reading about them about 12 years ago in either FHB or OHJ, maybe both.

- Jim Katen, Oregon

[PermaFLOW]

I think it is important to clarify a few issues being raised with regard to PermaFLOW (previosuly branded as Please Trap). Also, the pictures attached to the previous threads are not PermaFLOW, I am attaching the right picture.

For an average homeowner, clogged sink is a pain, frustration and something that occurs more often than needed and the cost and time required to fix it is not just about the cost of an average P-Trap. PermaFLOW has the potential to solve this issue for a lifetime with minimal preventive maintenance.

PermaFLOW is transparent and therefore allows the property owner or maintenance company the ability to see what is going on under their sinks. Its Self Cleaning design creates significant flow turbulence (upto four times the velocity of inlet water velocity - this is not required to be done manually as suggested in one of the previous replies), minimizes deposition, breaks and propels debris and cleans itself thereby not allowing the sinks to get clogged.

PermaFLOW also has EZClean feature that helps clean the potential clog build-up easily without the hassles of using plumbing snakes, plungers, opening P-Trap and/or the use of harmful drain cleaning chemicals by using an external knob with a spindle and wiper inside for clean-up.

Due to its unique ability to clean-up without the need to use Chemical Drain Cleaners, PermaFLOW is ‘Green by Design’ and helps reduce the nasty effects of chemicals, both to the environment and the property owner. PermaFLOW also works well with Low Flow Rate Fauctes (1.5 gpm or even lesser) where a traditional P-Trap has tendency to get clogged much easier.

PermaFLOW therefore adds significant GREEN Value to the property, community and the environment.

Further, due to the fact that with PermaFLOW the debris is being broken down and propelled out and never a large clog getting built inside the P-Trap (with little preventive maintenance), therefore the probability of getting clogs downstream of the P-Trap is also lower.

PermaFLOW is designed and manufactured in the USA and has been tested under extreme high traffic environments, has undergone IAPMO testing and is UPC Certified for US and Canada as well as certified to be compliant with IPC and IRC. It is built using transparent premium quality ABS Plastic and is therefore superior in finishing and longevity and provides a clear view in order to retrieve lost valuables. Unlike brass and chrome P-Traps, PermaFLOW is corrosion resistant.

You can visit www.permaflow.com for more information on the product, testing and certifications. Please contact me directly if you have any additional questions.

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[hausdok]

Hi,

Well, thank you for clarifying that but I want to know only one thing - can hair clog the thing up? My wife has very long hair and so far the only way to un-clog drains that her hair has clogged is by disassembling them. I can imagine that axle thingy becoming all bound up with long hair in no time.

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike

[plumbeck]

I like the by-pass on it!

When does a sink clog? It's always when family or guests are visiting or anytime that I am too busy to do one more thing ........

I can have a house full of company and the clog doesn't matter! I just move the paddle to the 3 0'clock position, or tell the kids to move it- they know how, and continue to use the sink. When folks are gone, the house is clean and I've rested, I'll evaluate whether I need to retrieve the toy or sweep the Permaflow.

[Inspectorjoe]

Copied from a PF WaterWorks press release:

“In an industry where one anticipates surprise at new developments, I have heard astonished plumbers say this is not a trap- it is a drain. I want this in my home! Women, on the other hand, excitedly report that now I can show off my plumbing and I can fix it myself! I have to be thrilled with these reactions,â€

[PermaFLOW]

PermaFLOW has been tested by IAPMO to IGC 225-06 standards that includes testing with multiple long hair strands multiple times - PermaFLOW didn't clog with hairs. Also, PermaFLOW has been used in residential and restaurant environments for close to a year and has not got clogged either with hairs or food debris.

PermaFLOW has a neat ByPass feature that basically menas that there are actually two P-Traps in one.....Even if there is a clog build up at the bottom - turning the knob to 3 O' Clock position provides another path for water to flow - until the buildup or blockage can be cleared.

There is a video showing the operation on www.permaflow.com

[Inspectorjoe]

Originally posted by PermaFLOW

Also, PermaFLOW has been used in residential and restaurant environments for close to a year and has not got clogged either with hairs or food debris.

How could you possibly know that?

[ozofprev]

In the event that a normal P-trap clogs, snaking is an option. If the PermaFlow clogs, it seems like dismantlement is the only option.

[PermaFLOW]

a. As stated above PermaFLOW functional testing is being monitored in high traffic restuarant and residential enviornments and we have full visibility on regular bass on the condition of the PermaFLOW. We know because we are monitoring it.

b. PermaFLOW is no different than a regular P-Trap under normal operation and using plunger, pouring chemicals or using snake are all possible if someone wants to - but shouldn't need to as the design takes care of cleanout.

[ozofprev]

Originally posted by PermaFLOW

...PermaFLOW is no different than a regular P-Trap under normal operation and using plunger, pouring chemicals or using snake are all possible if someone wants to - but shouldn't need to as the design takes care of cleanout.

Thank you.

[Inspectorjoe]

Originally posted by PermaFLOW

As stated above PermaFLOW functional testing is being monitored in high traffic restuarant and residential enviornments and we have full visibility on regular bass on the condition of the PermaFLOW. We know because we are monitoring it.

OK. Thanks for the answer. I don't mean to bust your chops, but that's not really what you stated:

"Also, PermaFLOW has been used in residential and restaurant environments for close to a year and has not got clogged either with hairs or food debris."

That could be taken to mean that NO PermaFlows have ever clogged (assuming you've sold some).

[Les]

Sanjay,

Thanks for the explainations. Are there any problems with the local authority having jurisdiction? How is inertia and siphon dealt with?

thanks!