Licensing Requirements

[Brian G]

What constitutes a valid test is another one of those side issues to licensing that currently has no good or fair answer. There are dozens of factors to be considered when trying to imagine what an ideal test might cover, not cover, etc., all contributing to the overall question of "How hard should it be?".

If you're going to give it as a prerequisite to even obtaining the right to work as an HI, is it fair or reasonable to give a test that a seasoned 20 year vet would consider "tough"? I don't see how it is. Is it fair or reasonable to the vets, the profession, or the consumer to give a test that almost anyone can pass. I don't see how again. So the test either has to find a middle ground (compromise) or you need more than one test, given at different points in time.

I like the second idea. A demanding but reasonable minimum competency test to get in the door, and a notably more demanding, comprehensive one after so many months / years / inspections. All combined with meaningful training requirements, field / peer review, and CE, carefully worked out by the same semi-miracle I suppose. With two tests niether one would have to compromise to avoid being unfair.

I don't know how many competeing exams there are out there, I've only heard about the NHIE and the Texas exam. I had to take the NHIE to obtain a license, without ever having performed a single inspection. The day I took it I was the only one who passed. I've heard some brag about blowing right through it without breaking a sweat, but later found that they had tons of experience in the field. Well duh, they should smoke it.

Brian G.

[DLRambo]

Two local inspectors recently took BOTH the NHIE and NAHI's Brand New CRI Exam, and said the NEW NAHI CRI Exam was a little tougher.

Its in the PYCHOMETICALLY REVIEW Process right now and about completed so we hear.

Guys that have taken the Texas Test say its STOUT.

In my area we have way more new inspectors passing the NHIE than passed the OLD ASHI Tests.

[DLRambo]

On Licensure / Grandfathering -

When I start thinking about "Grandfathering" of existing home inspectors with XXX years of experience or zzz many inspections, I have a hard time understanding WHY NOT. To start with like someone already said - many of these guys were the people that developed home inspections.

Then I think about education. I've always been an education junkie. As an example:

(1) when I had been doing HI's for about 8 yrs part time, I went to a 1 week long HI course;

(2) when I wanted to know more about boilers, I took a semester long nite course in "Boilers" from the HVAC dept at my local Jr. College;

(3)when I wanted to know more about electrical wiring, I took a semester long course in "residential wiring" at a local trade school;

(4) when I wanted to be BETTER at diagnosing structural problems, I enrolled in a 1 week course in "Structural Design" at the University of Wisconsin's School of Engineering - - then 6 months later took a 3 day class at Texas A&M on "Foundation Defects and Repairs";

(5) when I wanted to be more knowledgeable about building codes, I took 3 different 2 day classes on codes from ICBO and then got code certified by ICBO, BOCA, and later ICC.

I guess what I'm saying is that over the past 26 years of doing HI's, I've always figured that most long time inspectors have done similar things to get themselves educated about our business. In my area, even many of the "BAD INSPECTORS" aren't bad because they're dumb - most of the time I think they know whats right or wrong to do or say - they simply choose not to do so to appease the realestator.

So where does "Grandfathering" come into this. Do I fear testing - NO - I teach a 2 day class to help other inspectors pass the NAHI CRI, the NHIE, or various state exams.

Do I feel any need to take another test to validate myself against a NEW INSPECTOR with 50 inspections and a 1 week HI course - NO - I think a lot of old timers like myself think the same way not out of fear of another test, but because its almost a spit in the face.

Feedback Requested.

[chrisprickett]

I was grandfathered, but had to take the NHIA test and produce 250 fee paid inspectons. I thought that was reasonable.

Our state requires taking an accredited course, doing 30 paralels, and passing the NHIA. The schools offer the paralels as a package deal, and take 20 students with 5 inspectors on each inspection. Students are getting "Certified" with no clue.

I'm not sure what the answer is. In reality, my first 100 inspections were a joke.

[n/a29]

Dan,

I agree that those HI's out there like yourself should not be "compared" to green HI's like myself. I think the idea of testing and licensing is due to so many new HI's coming into the industry. How else can an HI's knowledge, experience, and credibility be evaluated in order to apply some regulation to the industry.

I can see your point how it might not be fair to make those of you who created the HI industry "face off", so to speak, with a newbie inspector like myself, but it is the only way to keep all inspectors on a level playing field, adhering everyone to the same standards.

I am sure you have passed the testing and other licensing criteria with flying colors, so really, ask yourself, is it that big of a deal to take the tests, etc. for the industry regulation criteria? The only thing that would really bite in your situation would be having to pay for taking the test, etc. Maybe instead of grandfathering the seasoned HI's and waving the necessity of licensing, etc., maybe the seasoned veteran HI's should not be charged the testing fees, etc.

I think most veteran HI's would be ok with having to take the test and get licensed if it didn't cost them anything to provide proof of their knowledge and experience.

What do you think?

[kurt]

Dan, I think you are the anomaly. The fact that you stay involved in continuing education & internet forums displays your commitment to excellence. There are whole big bunches of inspectors that just want to continue living & working in their own little universe. We all know a couple (or several!).

Requesting that an old timer take a test really isn't too much to ask; I did it, & it was painless. What is not fair is the requirement for 250 (or more) inspections for those folks that are clearly competent, but that is another story.

Licensing has done nothing but make my life easier. I didn't want licensing, but now that we got it, it's fine w/me. It's just a couple rules, that's all. We had so much fun for so many years playing the entire game by our own rules, it is a minor shock that a bigger picture is now in place. Oh well, time moves forward; we adapt, or we disappear. Just take the test; it's humorously simple.

[Brian G]

It's a damned thorny problem with no solution which is fair to all. When in doubt opt for the higher standard, test everyone. Too bad there's no way to test for realtor freindliness...blow in the machine, it buzzes, you lose your license. If only....

Hang in there Dan. Age before beauty. [:-dev3]

Brian G.

[Scottpat]

Not all "experienced" inspectors or is that "old" inspectors have maintained their education with the changing technology. Many inspectors learned how to do home inspections by working with another home inspector, or they just started to do them because they were in the building trades and they thought they had the knowledge to do inspections.

What I am trying to say is that we have many, many home inspectors across the country who have many, many years under their belts but in many cases they really don't have a clue as to what they are doing. It might be that they learned the profession from another inspector who had bad habits or inferior knowledge himself or they just picked up a flashlight and screwdriver and went to work. They never learned the proper way.

So testing is very important, just to make sure that the basic knowledge can be confirmed before a license is issued regardless of past history and experience.

My state made the mistake of grandfathering in inspectors, our only salvation was the mandatory E&O that separated the wannabee weekend inspectors from those that were serious.

[mcramer]

Licensing is great! Just ask the people in Mass.

http://www.boston.com/news/local/massac ... consumers/

[Brian G]

Originally posted by mcramer

Licensing is great! Just ask the people in Mass.

http://www.boston.com/news/local/massac ... consumers/

Yeah, Jim posted that too. It's a blackeye for the business there, but I don't see how it's a direct comment on licensing. They found a political snake in the woodpile, what else is new?

Brian G.

[Scottpat]

Brian,

We have an open seat on the regulation board, I can give your name to the Hailey if you want![:-bigeyes2]

[Brian G]

Originally posted by Scottpat

We have an open seat on the regulation board, I can give your name to the Hailey if you want!

Sure, throw it in there. I need a sidejob occasionally.

I had one other thought about that story. It does illustrate what I consider to be the trump card in the licensing debate. There this guy is, a bigshot appointee with a rolling business, but if the charges are proven out his license to work as a HI is gone. The laws differ quite a bit, but if they include decent standards and ethics it makes bucketheadism illegal and bucketheads outlaws. That's a very good thing.

Brian G.

[PeterD]

I may be naive, but I believe that licensing has GOT to be better than what's going on in the industry right now.

To that end, I would happily submit (OK...more like 'willingly' submit) to no 'grandfathering'. I've got all the stats that would allow me to be grandfathered (years, # of inspections, training, MRC's, etc) and I'll be honest when I say that it would irritate me to have to go through the process.

BUT...

If the alternative is all the other 'bucketheads' would also be grandfathered, then I'm willing to take a dose of medicine so that 'they' have to take it too.

We've all seen both the newbie inspector and the long-time inspector that doesn't do a professional inspection while they are cranking out 3-5 'inspections' per day. Their 'stats' might look good on paper but its a house of cards.

If the penalty for forcing these bucketheads to get training, education and pass a realistic test of their skills (and ethics?), then I will gladly agree to do the same.

[randalboyd]

Originally posted by DLRambo

Every once in awhile on varied inspector forums, I see new HI's complaing about proposed licensing requirements in their state. Many of their complaints are centered around required schooling; required years of doing HI; how many inspections are needed before being licensed; or grandfathering. Its made me stop and think about when I first got into HI full time.

In 1984 when I left Texas and moved north, there was nothing else outside of CREIA in California - so I joined ASHI. At that time they had 5 levels of membership. From ground zero they were as follows:

Apprentice Member (4); Technical Nominee (50); Intern Member (550); Associate Member (750); & Senior Member (1,000). The numbers after the levels were the required number of inspections. Until you got to be an Associate Member you could not use their logo or claim to belong.

Because I'd been doing HI's part-time in Texas since 1976, I went in as an Intern Member. I was living in a semi-small Missouri Town (population 65,000 at that time), surrounded by smaller farm towns. I qualified for the Associate Membership level about 2 years later. The following year I met the quota for Senior Member AND the next month they abandoned that program and went to 2 levels of membership (Member & Candidate).

Although I had done HI's part-time since 1976 - in 1984 when I decided to go at it full time, I spent $1,455 on air fare, hotel, and tuition and went to the D.C area to take a week long home inspection training program.

I'm not the only old inspector (57 yrs old) by a long shot that came up this way. Which is exactly why you see some of the rules you do being dropped into the licensing acts. By the way, 20 years ago talking a realestaor or often even a home buyer into getting a home inspection was like tring to get a 800 pound gorilla to hold still for a proctology examination.

For the record 1 yrs experience or 50 home inspections ain't squat. I've always been kinda partial to 5/1,000.

Dan Bowers