What Type of Reporting Method Do You Use?

[Marc]

Yeah, it's difficult to engender much tolerance for a noodge with one lifetime post lecturing us about professionalism. Next, indeed.

Maybe give him a chance to respond, and to learn. I made that same mistake on my very first post 14 months ago. Some criticism is warranted but it's very easy to overdo it and discourage a potential new contributor from ever returning.

Marc

[Bain]

Yeah, it's difficult to engender much tolerance for a noodge with one lifetime post lecturing us about professionalism. Next, indeed.

Maybe give him a chance to respond, and to learn. I made that same mistake on my very first post 14 months ago. Some criticism is warranted but it's very easy to overdo it and discourage a potential new contributor from ever returning.

Marc

True. I did everything I could to get rid of you--and I mean EVERYTHING--yet here you are, breaking my balls because of something I've said.

Disclaimer: For those lacking senses of humor, the above was said in jest. (That means wipe your eyes, Marc.)

[Les]

John,

Marc has proved to be a very difficult one to discourage. Lets not give up on it 'tho, he is still posting!

This is the second time, this week, I agree with Marc. I am sure I have reviewed as many or more inspection reports than anyone on this forum. I have grown more understanding of the reporting procedures across geographical boundries and in different economies.

I am not defending that website nor most of his comments. I would like to wait to see his response, if any.

[Mark P]

Eric, You truely will learn a lot from hanging around this web site. I see you've been in the HI since 2009, some of these guys have been doing this for over 20 years and some, like me for just 5-6 years or less. Don't go away with your feelings hurt, swallow your pride, if necessary, and stick around you will be a better inspector for it.

I've done 1 onsite report and will never do another.

[Bain]

Eric, You truely will learn a lot from hanging around this web site. I see you've been in the HI since 2009, some of these guys have been doing this for over 20 years and some, like me for just 5-6 years or less. Don't go away with your feelings hurt, swallow your pride, if necessary, and stick around you will be a better inspector for it.

I've done 1 onsite report and will never do another.

You're braver than I am, Mark, so kudos. I will never post a report. I'm in the more photos, less narrative camp. If we got into a discussion about how I deliver info to my clients, it would get ugly. Quick.

[mgbinspect]

Eric, you mention in your sample report that "all components designated for inspection in the ASHI Standards of Practice are inspected..." yet you are not affiliated with ASHI.

In fact, you show InterNACHI credentials all over your website but don't mention InterNACHI in your report.

Could you clarify the paradox?

Nice call, Randy. [:-thumbu]

[Nolan Kienitz]

Eric, you mention in your sample report that "all components designated for inspection in the ASHI Standards of Practice are inspected..." yet you are not affiliated with ASHI.

In fact, you show InterNACHI credentials all over your website but don't mention InterNACHI in your report.

Could you clarify the paradox?

Nice call, Randy. [:-thumbu]

Ditto ...

Also ... Eric ... you are inspecting in Florida, licensed in Florida and I'm pretty sure that Florida has a "Florida SOP". That is the SOP you should first/foremost be following and focusing on.

[kurt]

Yeah, it's difficult to engender much tolerance for a noodge with one lifetime post lecturing us about professionalism. Next, indeed.

Maybe give him a chance to respond, and to learn. I made that same mistake on my very first post 14 months ago. Some criticism is warranted but it's very easy to overdo it and discourage a potential new contributor from ever returning.

Marc

True. I did everything I could to get rid of you--and I mean EVERYTHING--yet here you are, breaking my balls because of something I've said.

Disclaimer: For those lacking senses of humor, the above was said in jest. (That means wipe your eyes, Marc.)

Both those posts are pretty funny. Yep, Marc came in busting balls, and he had some real ball busting returned. He kept coming back, and I've come to like the guy.

Maybe I was harsh, but I get real tired real quick with new inspectors giving the call for "professionalism" in this little thing we do.

Calling established entities report systems "unprofessional" without knowing dipsquat about the person behind the report is wrong. It's coming out of the gate into an arena, strutting stuff that shouldn't be strutted.

I'll wait and see if he's got the guts Marc's got.......if so, we'll get along fine.

[Bill Kibbel]

There's really no debate here. Computer printed reports done ON-SITE are the only true professional way to handle this, and here's why...

If the Inspector leaves the property to compile the data and misses something, he can either lie, guess, skip it, or try to see it off of the pictures he took. If he's building the report on-site, he can simply walk back inside.

If your discovering that you missed something while preparing a report, there's something seriously wrong with the inspection method.

If the report is e-mailed to the client, the client is left, alone, to try and figure out the report. They hired the inspector because they do not have the skill set to know these things on their own. If the report is built on-site, the Inspector can do a walkthru with the client to show them everything in the report, and answer questions.

If your clients have to "figure out the report", there's a problem with the writing. Doing an on-site report has nothing to do with "showing" the client all the issues with the property.

There's a reason why most of the guys that have been doing this successfully, for a quarter of a century or more, won't do reports on-site. What qualifies you as the guy that determines what is "the only true professional way"? Your examples sure don't back up that statement.

[Mike Lamb]

I provided reports on site for the better part of 11 years, Hometech BAR, and then my own similar 2 part system. My explanations of problems were hand-written and on the spot delivered. A positive to this was my description of issues had to be short, understandable and to the point. Or they were supposed to be.

A negative is it was mentally exhausting for me. I think some down time with relaxed thought is the better way to finally prepare the report.

My report is now emailed within 24 hours. Word doc typed w/ photos combined w/ my old field report (scanned) which is a check list w/ hand written comments. I think it’s pretty. The 2 parts are combined into a single PDF.

And I’d like to say that the most important part of my report is narrative. My clients are with me 99.9% of the time. I tell them to follow me and ask as many questions as they like (as long as it is with the flow of the inspection). They listen to me because I make them. They often learn a lot more than I write in the report.

[eaugustin]

I'm sorry it's taken a few days to respond. I've been swamped with Inspections.

Yes, my reports have built in narratives that need to be fixed on the template, and I'm catching most of them as I go. I do run across ones that I haven't seen before (there over 1000 built in comments) and I try to catch them all, but some get by. The big one is the ASHI disclaimer needs to be switched to InterNACHI (best site on Earth, by the way) and I switch on each inspection, but I have not on the template, yet.

I've been a HI since 2009, but I owned a very successful home remodeling business since 2002, and in residential construction since 1984, so it's not my first trip to the farm.

My skin is plenty thick enough for what I've seen here so far, but I don't see the draw to this sight? Do you all just sit around and write to each other? Am I missing something? I'll hang around a while and maybe I'll catch on here...

Anyway, bottom line, my customers love my reports. They love to be able to walk through with the report at the end of the inspection and go over each item. I guess it might suck that they have to wait on me to do the report on-site, "Sit around and tap their feet" I think was the clever comment posted here, but it sure beats driving back a second time to meet with the inspector, again, or to get it via e-mail. Even if you produce the best report in the world, the customer will have questions about it, and they would much rather have you there in person to go over it, then to play phone tag with you. IMHO

O.K. your turn.... Let me have it....

[Gibsonguy]

An onsite report seems stressful to complete. I like the idea of being able to walk away finished, but I can't see it with a narrative report with pictures. Does anyone else besides Mike Lamb use a combination checklist and narrative report here? I think I'm leaning in that direction as opposed to narrative only. I would like to get away from boilerplate all together, however I find myself unable to drop the CYA (Cover your a$$) portions.

I carry a Panasonic Toughbook CF-18 around with my modified 3D reporting software and complete as I go. I get the clients to sign the service agreement right on the screen and finish uploading the pictures and write the summary offsite.

[kurt]

OK, I'll let you have it.

The idea that one needs to meet the inspector again to go over the report means something is wrong. I do a few hundred inspections a year, and I only get a couple calls back to explain something.

This is the grand trick. Get in, do the job, get out, deliver the report, don't get any calls until they want you again.

I think delivering the report on site sets you up for providing an incomplete report. Take pictures, notes, go home, reflect, write the report. It's a better way to do it. For those with poor procedure, it's a problem. For those with good inspection procedure, it's a comfortable and good way to go at the task.

As far as professional society association, please leave it somewhere else, anywhere else, but don't bring it in here. Every one of the associations is an embarrassment on various levels. As soon as I hear someone trumpeting any of the "professional societies" as something special, I know someone has the vision of a cricket.

Edited post......

Yes, imagining that contractor experience provides a pass into this gig is a mistake. I think job site experience is invaluable and a great benefit, but it sure does not provide an education about this job. That was one of the hardest lessons I had. 20 years building is good for building; It's just a small part of inspecting competently.

[mgbinspect]

Originally posted by eaugustin

I've been a HI since 2009, but I owned a very successful home remodeling business since 2002, and in residential construction since 1984, so it's not my first trip to the farm.

My skin is plenty thick enough for what I've seen here so far, but I don't see the draw to this sight? Do you all just sit around and write to each other? Am I missing something? I'll hang around a while and maybe I'll catch on here...

O.K. your turn.... Let me have it....

Yeah... outside of a wealth of wisdom, knowledge, combined experience, insight, advice, all seasoned with a lot of humor, entertainment, and comradery, there really isn't much to write home about going on in here. I wouldn't hang out, if I were you. []

Honestly, I was a Design/Build contractor and mason before this gig. And like you, I thought my experience gave me an automatic free pass into the home inspection profession. I was even tempted to skip the whole academy deal. BOY, was I wrong! The first thing contractors usually have to get over is the great big egos they have, which prevent them from realizing just how much there is to learn.

Tragically, that all too typical attitude can truly cause an engineer or contractor to really suck at inspecting homes - especially regarding presentation and documentation. I've followed behind such inspectors wondering how in the heck did he miss this?

I find that just one of the many cool things about hanging out here is getting to sit at the feet of truly brilliant guys from specialized fields and ask them questions like this. Truth be told, the schooling never ever ends, and the sooner we realize that the better we become. [:-graduat

[resqman]

All forums have their regulars, groupies and "me to" wanna be. They set the tone and culture for that forum. They usually post so often, one wonders when they have time to do anything else in their life. Newcomers are tolerated if they don't rock the boat TOO much. A little diversity and different point of view is tolerated but completely opposite view points are usually drown out. Telling the regulars they are unknowledgeable or overbearing is never tolerated.

If you only read one newspaper, then you tend to start adopting their point of view. If you get your news from several sources, then you can compare and contrast and begin to see the truth of the matter. Or at the very least you are forced to examine your own point of view and become better prepared to defend it.

Most of the regulars have lots of time in the field. They have become very entrenched in their positions. Many of the positions are developed by years of seeing and doing the job. Some of there positions are just because they are grumpy old men who feel they have earned the right to dismiss anyone who does not agree with them. Even the grumpy old men who scream the loudest have something useful to say once in a while. Overall, they tend to be on target more often than not.

Get your news from multiple sources. Mull over the different points of view and take the best and incorporate it into your business and life. The new kid in the sandbox has to learn the rules of the local playground or he will get lots of sand kicked in his face.

[kurt]

Those are all good sound observations, but they're flawed in various ways. I disagree completely with the one about "newcomers will be tolerated if they don't rock the boat too much".

Newcomers that show up with real information that's spot on and credible are welcomed completely. I hope they rock the boat. A lot.

Grumpy old men don't dismiss folks just because they're grumpy. Folks get dismissed because it's painfully obvious to grumpy old men when some youngster (not defined by age) is blowing smoke they don't understand.

For lack of a better aphorism that describes TIJ, I'll call it the "no spin zone". If you've got facts and you back them up with credible reference material, you'll be welcomed and encouraged to speak up. The grumpy old men would love a breather from having to police all the stupid crap that gets put up all the time by youngsters.

Please, come with facts that are indisputable. Take over. I'll be happy to shut up and go find a cup of coffee.

The newcomers that aren't tolerated very well are the one's that show up with 20 years experience as a contractor thinking they know the gig, and start lecturing. Or, they start advising everyone about "professionalism" on their first post. Or, they have some idea about reporting that's been run through all of our mills for a few decades and we know it's just not right. Yep, no tolerance. There's just not enough time in the day to listen to foolishness.

After that, yes; read a lot of newspapers. If you're getting all your information from one place, you're not well informed.

[Tim Maxwell]

Anyway, bottom line, my customers love my reports. They love to be able to walk through with the report at the end of the inspection and go over each item. I guess it might suck that they have to wait on me to do the report on-site, "Sit around and tap their feet" I think was the clever comment posted here, but it sure beats driving back a second time to meet with the inspector, again, or to get it via e-mail. Even if you produce the best report in the world, the customer will have questions about it, and they would much rather have you there in person to go over it, then to play phone tag with you. IMHO

I rarely if ever get calls with questions, and that doesn't seem to matter if the buyer was there or not. Many of them will say when scheduling, "oh, I will call you as I am sure I will have lots of questions". They never call.

And I can honestly say that I have never been back to the house to meet a buyer after the inspection.

[Bain]

Those are all good sound observations, but they're flawed in various ways. I disagree completely with the one about "newcomers will be tolerated if they don't rock the boat too much".

Newcomers that show up with real information that's spot on and credible are welcomed completely. I hope they rock the boat. A lot.

Grumpy old men don't dismiss folks just because they're grumpy. Folks get dismissed because it's painfully obvious to grumpy old men when some youngster (not defined by age) is blowing smoke they don't understand.

For lack of a better aphorism that describes TIJ, I'll call it the "no spin zone". If you've got facts and you back them up with credible reference material, you'll be welcomed and encouraged to speak up. The grumpy old men would love a breather from having to police all the stupid crap that gets put up all the time by youngsters.

Please, come with facts that are indisputable. Take over. I'll be happy to shut up and go find a cup of coffee.

The newcomers that aren't tolerated very well are the one's that show up with 20 years experience as a contractor thinking they know the gig, and start lecturing. Or, they start advising everyone about "professionalism" on their first post. Or, they have some idea about reporting that's been run through all of our mills for a few decades and we know it's just not right. Yep, no tolerance. There's just not enough time in the day to listen to foolishness.

After that, yes; read a lot of newspapers. If you're getting all your information from one place, you're not well informed.

The secret is humility. No one who wanders into this place is going to know more than the collective body. No one. So anyone who wants to walk in and proselytize about what's right and what's wrong may as well bend over and get prepared for an ass kicking.

The copper, radiant-heat system being discussed in another thread? I've never seen one, and probably never will. But if I do, I know I can pop in and ask what to look for and what to be aware of, and others will race in to lend a hand.

Unlike most of the others here, I don't let my clients follow me around while checking out a house. I find it too distracting. But that's just me. It isn't right and it isn't wrong. It's just how I like to do things. But if I came aboard and started telling folks that my way was the ONLY way and the PROFESSIONAL way? That would be insulting, and I'd deserve any and all flak that was tossed back in response.

[eaugustin]

In one breath you say 20 years of building experience does not make you a Home Inspector, then you say if you're new, go get some experience before you speak. If I thought my 20+ years of experience was enough, I would not have gone with AHIT for training (insert your joke here), then joined a nameless professional society association and have earned more than 250+ hours of CE's.

I don't know everything, and never will, and the need to broaden my vision is what brought me here instead of sitting on my nameless professional society association site where everyone knows me.

However, I do have an opinion, and will state it, whether it's my first post or my 1000th post. Sorry if I stepped on any toes.

I don't believe you serve your customer in the best possible fashion by e-mailing in your report. I just don't. I've spent a lot of money to set myself up for on-site reporting because I feel it's the best way. When I go to my doctor for a check up, I have to come back for the results. They don't just e-mail it to my computer. The main reason is I won't understand the report completely. I guess I could tell my doctor that if he wrote a better report I would not have to come back, he could just e-mail it, and save us both some time. And the statement about going home, reflect, write the report scares me. What do you do if you miss or forget to note something. It happens, it really does, unless you're perfect? I've forgot things. Am I incompetent? Should I leave this field? Some will say yes, but my desire to serve my customer to my best possible abilty will make me a better Home Inspector.

I look forward to your rebuttal.

[mgbinspect]

As Zig Ziglar used to comment about his southern drawl, "Just keep comin' back, and I'll have you speaking normally in no time." []

Another great thing about hanging out here is being challenged to actually question the things you do and why you do them, even if it means the conclusion is that it's right for you.

Carry on, bro.[:-thumbu]

[kurt]

.pdf

[resqman]

I don't believe you serve your customer in the best possible fashion by e-mailing in your report. I just don't. ...The main reason is I won't understand the report completely. ... And the statement about going home, reflect, write the report scares me. What do you do if you miss or forget to note something.

You are running your business the way you think is best. The general consensus on this board and most other home inspector forums is that writing the report onsite is not the best thing for the home inspector and the client. The HI is under pressure to deliver the report so fast that the writing suffers, and simple mistakes like Brick Masonry and Brick Veneer show up in the same sentence. If does not provide time for the HI to take advantage of reference material like code books or other inspectors.

If your report requires additional explanation for a client to understand, then you need to change your report writing. Different states and SOPs require usually minor changes in reporting. Change how and what you report so that anyone, really anyone, could pick up the report and immediately understand what the problem is. If you have to walk them through the house a second time to understand your report, then your report is not effective.

Yes, all home inspectors forget to check or inspect an item from time to time. How often in the last year have you had to go back into the home to re-check something you missed? If the answer is more than 3 than you need to change the way you inspect. Overlooking items during the inspection is not a reporting concern, it is an inspecting concern.

[Tim Maxwell]

When scheduling, many buyers ask how long after the inspection till I get the final report. Most of them are surprised when I tell them I will email it to them the same evening.

I have never, not even once, had a buyer act like they expected the report on site.

I always tell them when they schedule how it will go basically and they are always fine with that.

I go over my notes, pictures, and what I have entered in the laptop before I leave to make sure I have everything I need to finish the report.

So getting home and realizing that I forgot something is going to be a rare day. And when it happens there will only be one choice. Go back, get the info/photo or what ever it is to finish the report.

[randynavarro]

One of the finest home inspectors in the country delivers his report on site.

Correct me if I'm wrong, Mr. Katen.

This doesn't make that method better than delivering the report later; it's just what works for the individual.

Pissing over each other arguing which method is better is getting boring. Suffice to say, I'm pretty confident a large majority deliver the report later. A minority of inspectors deliver on site.

Way to hang, Eric.

Edit: By the way, Eric, the doctor analogy is pretty poor, IMO. I hate going back to the dr's office a second time just to get test results. I wish they would just email it to me along with a few comments and recommendations from the doc. Much more convenient.

[Nolan Kienitz]

Edit: By the way, Eric, the doctor analogy is pretty poor, IMO. I hate going back to the dr's office a second time just to get test results. I wish they would just email it to me along with a few comments and recommendations from the doc. Much more convenient.

I visit my endocrinologist every 3-4 months with visits for labs. My doc e-mails me with the labs and comments. Works great.