ladder rope

[Bill Kibbel]

I don't know what all the hub-bub is about. There's just some who have skills and some that don't. It's not an issue getting around the eaves if you think outside the box. It doesn't cause any more damage than the ladder does leaning on the gutter and you have to remember the ladder mittens.

To each his own, no ropes for me and if not on someone else's house then whos?

So the folks that have ropes on their ladders don't have any skills?

If I saw anyone "bouncing" a ladder on any part of my home, they'd find themselves rapidly descending towards the earth.

[Jim Katen]

. . . It's not an issue getting around the eaves if you think outside the box. . . .

I've bounced a few ladders in my time but I'm going to call you on that one. How the heck are you going to bounce out from a sidewall to a 2'- wide projecting eave when you're 30' off the ground?

[kurt]

There's just some who have skills and some that don't.

I've bounced ladders, but claiming it takes anything more than dismissal of intelligence is kinda blank.

[Richard Moore]

I don't recommend the Telesteps. It is a crappy little ladder and not to be trusted, ever.

That's why we use the Xtend & Climb brand.

I have no first hand knowledge of the Xtend and Climb, and really don't care whether anyone buys a Telesteps, or not. The following is just my personal observation, FWIW, rather than a testimonial.

I have been using the same 12.5' Telesteps since I downsized to the Mini in 2005. It gets used inside and out on almost all homes. In fact, I doubt I take the 21' LG off the car roof for 10% of the homes I do. I'm quite adept at leapfrogging from lower roofs. I'm also no lightweight at anywhere between 190 and 230 during those years. Aside from periodically replacing worn rubber feet, I have not had a single issue, and certainly no failures or collapses, with my ladder. I do take care to eyeball the latches each time I extend it, but then I'm old and don't bounce anymore. Yes, occasionally, a latch may not fully engage. But I find that visually obvious and an extra tug on the last open section or a bounce on that foot always clicks it into place. No, it's not totally foolproof, but perhaps fools shouldn't be climbing ladders?

About 6 years ago, I happened upon a tremendous, and short lived, online deal on Telesteps. I don't know if they were surplus or had fallen off the back of a truck. Anyway, I grabbed 2 extras for a total price less than I paid for my original one. I passed one on to a friend, the other I stored in my garage as a back-up. To this day, it's still sitting there, totally unused.

BTW, the Erecto-Ladder was my first choice, but I couldn't quite grasp the instructions.

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[Jim Morrison]

I suppose I've just never been around bouncing ladder guys, as I have never seen this technique. Seems more trouble then just pulling a rope.

And a whole lot less professional. I've never seen anyone bounce a ladder and I never considered replacing the ropes on mine every year or two a hardship. What home inspector doesn't have time to maintain their equipment in January?

[ghentjr]

And a whole lot less professional. I've never seen anyone bounce a ladder and I never considered replacing the ropes on mine every year or two a hardship. What home inspector doesn't have time to maintain their equipment in January?

With all due respect, when you keep your ladder on your car and your car outside, in January or any winter month, the rope is the first thing to freeze.

[John Kogel]

And a whole lot less professional. I've never seen anyone bounce a ladder and I never considered replacing the ropes on mine every year or two a hardship. What home inspector doesn't have time to maintain their equipment in January?

With all due respect, when you keep your ladder on your car and your car outside, in January or any winter month, the rope is the first thing to freeze.

Easy one. Use an old extension cord on your ladder and just plug it in at night. 120 volts will keep the metal thieves bouncing. []

[ericwlewis]

Jim K.-Most eaves I've come across are only about 20' from ground level. If it's a gable you're referring to, just run the ladder up whilst on the gutter and walk it around the corner. There's no need to climb over an eave on the gable anyway, is there?

Kurt, I don't understand your comment.

Bill, don't worry I won't be near your home and I didn't say "Ropies" don't have any skills. I may have implied it though. I apologize for that.

Jim M. -How do you know it's "a whole lot less professional" if you've never seen it done? I don't consider putting the rope back on the ladder maintenance. I've never had the need to "bounce" the ladder on an inspection anyway.

I hope this answers all your questions and concerns. It doesn't change my original answer though.

"I find that it gets in the way. I can put mittens on the tips and "bounce" them up to the extension I want.

Just general preference I suppose."

[Jim Katen]

Jim K.-Most eaves I've come across are only about 20' from ground level. If it's a gable you're referring to, just run the ladder up whilst on the gutter and walk it around the corner. There's no need to climb over an eave on the gable anyway, is there?

I see eaves and gable ends, both, that are more than 20' above the ground all the time. If the point of the exercise it to get myself onto the roof, I don't see how you can do that by bouncing. You said, "It's not an issue getting around the eaves if you think outside the box."

If I have the room, I can extend the ladder on the ground and walk it up. If I have a rope, I can extend it straight up. But there's no way that I'm going to get to the roof by bouncing it.

[kurt]

Kurt, I don't understand your comment.

You implied it takes skill to bounce ladders. I implied all it takes is dismissing intelligence. I've done it, lots of times; I wasn't thinking when I did it.

It's a fools activity.

[ericwlewis]

Kurt, I don't understand your comment.

You implied it takes skill to bounce ladders. I implied all it takes is dismissing intelligence. I've done it, lots of times; I wasn't thinking when I did it.

It's a fools activity.

Nice guy. You don't know me or my activities, yet you feel you can call me a fool.

I've always wondered about you and a few others on this forum. Now after a couple of recent threads, it's confirmed. Thanks.

[kurt]

Actually, I do know about your activity; you told us about it. Proudly.

Jumping around on ladders is foolish; I've done it enough to know. We're both fools for doing it.

Are we so grand that we are incapable of acknowledging we've been fools?

I can only wish I wasn't a fool about a lot of things in life.

Sheesh.....

[Jim Morrison]

Jim M. -How do you know it's "a whole lot less professional" if you've never seen it done? I don't consider putting the rope back on the ladder maintenance. I've never had the need to "bounce" the ladder on an inspection anyway.

"I find that it gets in the way. I can put mittens on the tips and "bounce" them up to the extension I want.

Just general preference I suppose."[/b]

I've never seen anyone perform an inspection while picking his nose either, but I guess I feel comfortable rendering an opinion about that method as well.

I carried a 24' and a 40' extension ladder with a brace to every inspection for over 20 years. Every extension ladder I ever bought came with a rope. When the rope wore out, I replaced it.

Every truck I ever bought came with tires and when they wore out, I replaced them too. I'm going to disagree with you and still call that maintenance

I wouldn't try to change your mind, but I don't think ladder-bouncin' would cut it in the Boston market and probably a lot of others. Shoot, I caught enough flak just going on a roof without slam-dancin' my way up and down.

Cheers,

Jimmy

Above all, you should follow your Muse.

[John Dirks Jr]

32' of 3/8" poly braid from Lowes. $4 clothesline pulley from Walmart.

The larger pulley surely makes retraction easier. It requires less friction from grip on the rope as the top section slides down. Less wear on the gloves too.

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[Inspectorjoe]

I couldn't help but think of this thread during an inspection this morning. I got the inspection because of a ladder accident.

The gentleman who had owned the house grew grapes on this trellis. He was on a stepladder, picking them, and was probably no more than a foot or two off the ground. See the open tee? There's a piece of rusted pipe in there. Instead of moving the ladder, the guy leaned out further than he should have and grabbed onto the pipe that used to be there. It snapped off, and he went headfirst into the patio slab.

Dead, with a widow left behind because of a stupid shortcut on a ladder.

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[John Kogel]

32' of 3/8" poly braid from Lowes. $4 clothesline pulley from Walmart.

The larger pulley surely makes retraction easier. It requires less friction from grip on the rope as the top section slides down. Less wear on the gloves too.

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Nice one, John. The plain Jane pulley looks like it belongs there. Nice rope that will last. Gloves are good.

I just wish you had used a Bowline knot on the rung. That is the knot that won't undo itself. Melt the end of the rope too, eh? []

[John Dirks Jr]

On second thought, the size of the pulley won't change the effort required. Not with a single pulley. In order for there to be a change in required effort you would need two or more pulleys of differing sizes to make a ratio change.

Do I have this correct?

However, I think the radius of a larger pulley reduces the stress on the rope.

[Marc]

On second thought, the size of the pulley won't change the effort required. Not with a single pulley. In order for there to be a change in required effort you would need two or more pulleys of differing sizes to make a ratio change.

Do I have this correct?

However, I think the radius of a larger pulley reduces the stress on the rope.

Four ropes takes 1/2 (2/4) the force of two but takes twice as long to get it up.

Marc

[Jim Katen]

On second thought, the size of the pulley won't change the effort required. Not with a single pulley. In order for there to be a change in required effort you would need two or more pulleys of differing sizes to make a ratio change.

Do I have this correct?

However, I think the radius of a larger pulley reduces the stress on the rope.

With only one pulley, you have to pull with a force equal to the weight of the moving section of the ladder. If you add a second pulley that travels on the moving section, you'll only have to pull half the weight of the moving section, but for every foot you pull, the section will only move 6". The size of the pulleys doesn't affect the mechanical advantage of the system. All of this assumes no losses due to friction.

The size of the sheave affects friction losses, especially with cheap pulleys like the ones you're using. Larger sheaves have lower losses and, as you say, place less stress on the rope. If you wanted to get fancy, you'd buy a pulley with bearings. But before you do that, polish the business ends of the dogs to make them less likely to stick on the way up - especially if it's a big ladder.

[John Kogel]

That's right, the big pulley reduces friction, so it is an easier pull, and it reduces strain on the rope.

For a mechanical advantage, you need to add another pulley at the bottom and run the rope back up to the top.

Too much rope doing it that way. Install a little winch on there that you can run with a cordless drill. []

[Mark P]

That's What She Said.

[Inspectorjoe]

That's right, the big pulley reduces friction, so it is an easier pull, and it reduces strain on the rope.

How does a bigger pulley reduce friction?

[Jim Katen]

That's right, the big pulley reduces friction, so it is an easier pull, and it reduces strain on the rope.

How does a bigger pulley reduce friction?

I don't suppose it actually reduces the friction itself, but it reduces losses to friction. It's simple leverage.

[Inspectorjoe]

With the exception of a smaller pulley maybe having more slippage, I don't understand how a larger one reduces losses to friction. The rope and pulley should be turning at the same speed, so there shouldn't be any friction there. The only appreciable friction would be at the shaft. I suppose a smaller pulley turning faster would generate more friction, but I can't see that making much of a difference.

What am I missing?

[Jim Katen]

With the exception of a smaller pulley maybe having more slippage, I don't understand how a larger one reduces losses to friction. The rope and pulley should be turning at the same speed, so there shouldn't be any friction there. The only appreciable friction would be at the shaft. I suppose a smaller pulley turning faster would generate more friction, but I can't see that making much of a difference.

What am I missing?

There's friction at the shaft, which is overcome more easily with a bigger sheave.

There's also another type of friction, similar to rolling friction on a wheel. It has to do with the deformation of the rope as is engages the groove on the sheave on one side and disengages from it on the other side. That friction is reduced with a larger sheave just as rolling friction is reduced with a larger wheel.

The effect is probably small, but my hunch is that it's noticable.