Infrared: A New Versatile Diagnostic Tool

[tbird]

I too am considering adding infrared imaging to my scope. The Razr does take a standard image and the infrared with the same unit. Does flir do that? I found out the razr is the same as the mobir made by Wuhan Guide Infrared Technology http://www.guide-infrared.com out of China and stamped with whatever name you want on it. I am impressed by the features of the razr/mobir but am not sure how it would hold up or the service available.

Long time observer, first time poster.

[randynavarro]

MOMENTARY THREAD DRIFT!!

tbird: Say hi to Prescott for me. Born and raised there. Folks still living there. I vist once or twice a year.

NOW BACK TO REGULAR SCHEDULED PROGRAMING

[Jim Katen]

Originally posted by Richard Stanley

. . . There is an inspector in Idaho (I think) that uses infrared and sells software for it. I originally got his site from Mike ) on this board - now I can't find it and can't remember his name. He knows Mike. Anyway, He has software that puts the thermal image inside the digital pic and it impressed me. He told me what it was when I asked him via E-mail. (can't find that either) He also writes a newsletter of some sort. Mike - help. . . .

Perhaps you're thinking of Michael Leavitt in Orem, Utah? Check him out here:

http://www.thehomeinspector.com/Inspect ... Order.html

- Jim Katen, Oregon

[hausdok]

Hi,

Yeah, that would be Michael Leavitt and the Monday Morning Messenger, but I don't remember anything about IR technology. He's a 3-D user and has some customized 3-D plug-ins that he sells. He could be doing something with IR now, but I have no knowledge of that.

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike

[Richard Stanley]

Yes, that's him. This link takes you to the thermal pages.

Thanks Jim.

http://www.thehomeinspector.com/Clients/Thermal.html

[Jim Katen]

Originally posted by hausdok

Hi,

Yeah, that would be Michael Leavitt and the Monday Morning Messenger, but I don't remember anything about IR technology. He's a 3-D user and has some customized 3-D plug-ins that he sells. He could be doing something with IR now, but I have no knowledge of that.

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike

Yes. He has a customized 3-D system just for thermal scanning.

http://www.thehomeinspector.com/Inspect ... ermal.html

- Jim Katen, Oregon

[hausdok]

Well, there you go. I learned something. A day that passes and one doesn't learn something is a day wasted.

OT - OF!!!

M.

[roadguy]

Kurt,

The field of view for the fixed focus lens on the RAZir is 25x19 (degrees). The FLIR standard lens is 19x14 and the wide angle is 34x25, hence the razir would fall in between the two, slightly wider than the standard but not nearly as wide as the wide-angle. There is a telephoto available for the razir, but I can't see that it would be all that useable for HI.

On a different note: Has anyone explored the rental option? Given the propensity for techno-gadgetry such as this to improve rapidly (and the price to come down fairly rapidly), it might be a good way for a guy to get into it without having the "Doh, I wish I'd waited 'til this [insert latest feature here] had come out" moment.[?]

[kurt]

Thanks. I'm thinking wide angle is the ticket.

And, definitely agreed on the techno-gadget obsolescence schedule; this stuff is going to be outdated next week. Heck, the price on the B2 has dropped $6000 since I started looking seriously about a year ago. You know the thing is going to be about $5000 in a year.

I'm gonna lease it, even though I normally never lease anything.

They've got some lease deals @ Flir-Direct.

[Jim Katen]

Originally posted by kurt

. . . I'm gonna lease it, even though I normally never lease anything.

They've got some lease deals @ Flir-Direct.

The lease deals I've seen are not particularly attractive.

- Jim Katen, Oregon

[carle3]

Just got done at a seminar with the FLIR sales rep there. The price on the B2 has dropped to 9600.00

[kurt]

Originally posted by Jim Katen

Originally posted by kurt

The lease deals I've seen are not particularly attractive.

- Jim Katen, Oregon

I know. Right now, it's a question of which way to get poleaxed; pay retail, own it, and watch as price evaporates to half what I paid only a year ago, or lease and watch as the money evaporates into not owning anything after making payments for 3 years.

[roadguy]

...it's a question of which way to get poleaxed; pay retail, own it, and watch as price evaporates to half what I paid only a year ago, or lease and watch as the money evaporates into not owning anything after making payments for 3 years.

Right on, Kurt, right freakin' on [:-yuck].

That's why , in my original post way back yonder, I was lobbying for some "collective bargaining" on the part of the folks from this forum with respects to the features/pricing available from the manufacturer's. It digressed into a "Ford vs. Chevy, which brand is better" thing. Quite frankly, I'm most interested in the best way to gain access to the equipment in a cost-effective way. Anyone ever heard of volume discounts?![:-party] I realize that this isn't an association; it's a professional improvement forum. But...[]

[maloneyandco]

I'm ready to buy. The price for the InfraCam @ $6,500 is really good. I have had the sales rep to my home twice to look at the camera. I'm having a hard time justifying an extra #3,450 for the ThermaCam E45. The resolution is better put do I really need it better? I also liked the feel of the InfraCam better. It was easier to scan what I wanted. Will the InfraCam allow me look professional and present images well enough to do home audits ? I have been self employed in construction for over thirty years and have bought many tools that do the job and don't have all the bells and whistles. I guess I'm justifying the purchase to myself. Also opening up some the subject for more debate.

Does anyone use the InfraCam? Can anyone recommend it?

Thanks

Rob

[Richard Stanley]

I use it. See previous posts in this thread.

[maloneyandco]

Thank you Richard. I re-read the posts and saw you use the B-Cam same as Infracam. That is great to know.

Thanks again

Rob

[blunsford]

One thing that hasn't been discussed much is the marketing aspect. I know it was mentioned briefly, but it seems to me that using IR would really help the word of mouth marketing, eh?

www.ableinspector.com

[mikeinspector]

The Razir thermal infrared camera is a very useful device, I got mine at $9500, with all of the full software, it also came with a coupl eof other reporting and imaging software called fusion IR and ez report. The infrared camera itself is the smallest i have seen in the market, I like the features and the fact it has 4 batteries, the image quality is really nice and it had the digital zoom capability with the thermal and the digital cameras built in. Definately the best camera i've seen for under $10,000. The camera is so sensitive, we actaully see pipes behind the wall, mold, water damage, missing isulation and air infiltration. The camera was purchased for doing roofing surveys along with electrical and mechanical infrared thermography inspections, but having it for commercial and residential is an added perk. We did get the Telephoto lens after the initial purchase of the camera which has very long range zoom. We use it for electrical power pole, transmission line inspections. The lens was an additional $2000. The camera paid for itself within 2 1/2 months.

I found mine at the following website;

http://www.7b.org/razir.html

www.7b.org/razir.html

Cheers

[NPILarry]

My name is Larry, My company is National Property Inspections. I have and use a FLIR B2 infrared camera on all inspections and have certification training from ITC. I can tell you first hand that the technology is well worth the investment.[^]

[Jim Katen]

Originally posted by NPILarry

My name is Larry, My company is National Property Inspections. I have and use a FLIR B2 infrared camera on all inspections and have certification training from ITC. I can tell you first hand that the technology is well worth the investment.[^]

Did you raise your prices when you started including IR thermography in your regular home inspections?

Did you track the ways in which the IR camera increased your revenues?

How long did it take to pay for the cost of the camera through increased revenue that it generated?

Is the B-2 still the best tool out there or, if you had it to do over, would you pick another?

- Jim Katen, Oregon

[pmmorton]

I work with HomeSafe Inspection. We have around 20 franchises in three countries. We use infrared and acoustic equipment in all of our inspections. Realtors really seem to be opening up to the idea of this advanced technology, especially when they realize that it helps them close more deals and reduce the risk of lawsuits. Our list of clients is expanding everyday. We just opened up a blog (http://homesafe-inspection.blogspot.com). We've posted some pretty interesting information about home inspections with more to come soon.

[Scottpat]

Phillip, please tell Peng that I said HI!

[mthomas1]

Hmm... just did my first inspection with my new cam (Fluke).

My normal procedure is to check every suspect (for example, missing kickout flashing) roof/wall junction at the interior with a meter if accessible.

This time I checked the wall with the cam first... and caught an intrusion (verified with the Tramex) at a location where I would probably not have caught it with the meter alone, about 5 feet out from the gutter above a window header and out of arm's reach of where I would normally have set up the ladder opposite the eave to meter the wall. Knowing it was there, it was possible to work out the logic of how water could have likely traveled along the header, but even knowing it was present there was no evidence of the problem at the wall's surface visible to the naked eye.

If this is typical of the increase in the number of problems I'll be finding, I am going to have to think more carefully than I had supposed about marketing and price.

As for liability, I can see some considerable upsides.

For example last summer I had clients complaining about water intrusions after very heavy rains following a long dry spell.

There was no way I could have predicted the likelihood of subsequent problems at the time of the dry spell inspections, but in the future when I find (for example) questionable flashing over windows and doors I plan to image the areas and archive the pictures.

If there is a subsequent water problem I will scan again, and hopefully not only be able to demonstrate based on the image's differences that excessive moisture was not present at the time of inspection, but also turn the client's perceptions around by being able in some cases to assist in diagnosing the immediate problem, and perhaps even pick up additional work checking the entire property.

[Chris Bernhardt]

If this is typical of the increase in the number of problems I'll be finding, I am going to have to think more carefully than I had supposed about marketing and price.

If you employ an IR camera in general HI work, it will increase your onsite inspection time significantly. The expense of the increased time will swamp what you paid for the expense of the IR cam in less than a year!

I think that I have probably increased my use of my moisture meters a 1000% since I started using an IR cam.

If you are already spending 3 hours just doing a visual inspection absent any report writing, then you should expect to see another hour added to many inspections.

Pre IR I was getting thru most inspections absent report writing in a little over 2 hours. Post IR the typical inspection ends up being 3 hours and thats with me running.

Chris, Oregon

[Jim Katen]

Originally posted by Chris Bernhardt

If this is typical of the increase in the number of problems I'll be finding, I am going to have to think more carefully than I had supposed about marketing and price.

If you employ an IR camera in general HI work, it will increase your onsite inspection time significantly. The expense of the increased time will swamp what you paid for the expense of the IR cam in less than a year!

I think that I have probably increased my use of my moisture meters a 1000% since I started using an IR cam.

If you are already spending 3 hours just doing a visual inspection absent any report writing, then you should expect to see another hour added to many inspections.

Pre IR I was getting thru most inspections absent report writing in a little over 2 hours. Post IR the typical inspection ends up being 3 hours and thats with me running.

Chris, Oregon

So what happens to some poor fool who's average inspection time (pre-IR) is more like, oh say, 5 hours?

- Jim Katen, Oregon