Too many joints. Pex

[gtblum]

Now that we see more pex, has anyone else noticed that that plumbers seem to not get the idea that it's meant to be bent and not jointed at every turn like copper?

[Jim Katen]

Now that we see more pex, has anyone else noticed that that plumbers seem to not get the idea that it's meant to be bent and not jointed at every turn like copper?

I haven't noticed that in my area. But then, PEX has been the defacto standard here for almost a decade so the plumbers are used to it. Most of the younger plumbers have no idea how to sweat a copper fitting or thread a piece of steel, but they're good a running PEX. Unnecessary fittings take time & cost money. They're not likely to spend time or money unnecessarily.

The thing that drives me crazy is when they do a home-run system they bundle the hot & cold tubes together in one big wad and then wrap insulation around the whole thing.

If PEX ever turns out to be a defective product that fails after, say, 20 years, the housing stock around here will be in big, big trouble.

- Jim Katen, Oregon

[Terence McCann]

Now that we see more pex, has anyone else noticed that that plumbers seem to not get the idea that it's meant to be bent and not jointed at every turn like copper?

I haven't noticed that in my area. But then, PEX has been the defacto standard here for almost a decade so the plumbers are used to it. Most of the younger plumbers have no idea how to sweat a copper fitting or thread a piece of steel, but they're good a running PEX.

That's sad.

[Nolan Kienitz]

Bad installation of PEX in a new home down here experienced ~12-leaks at locations throughout the home over the course of 10-months.

Many were improperly done fittings and the remainder were traced to a "handling" issue of the roll of PEX from the plumber's truck to the house. When the plumber used his knife to cut the wrap holding the roll of PEX he slightly nicked the surface across several turns.

Well ... over time, with water pressure those little "nicks" failed and sprung leaks at locations all over the house.

The wooden floors had been removed and replaced 3-times along with all the kitchen cabinets and more and more.

My client was about to go to court and sue, but builder stepped up and made the plumber's company (a rather large firm in the D/FW market) buy the house back and the builder put the client in a new home.

Builder/plumber is gutting the house and redoing the PEX install. My client is chilling for a number of months and will sell the 'new' house and find another builder and go again.

This was the path of least resistance and didn't cost my client any $$ ... save for the continued water leaks and rebuilding and general heartburn.

I've become quite leary of PEX primarily from this experience.

[hausdok]

There's a ton of PEX around here. Most installs I see are decent. The nicks that Nolan talks about are important though. Went back today to do a preventive maintenance inspection on a house that I did for a client nearly three years ago. He told me that nearly two years into the house they noticed a wall was damp. When a contractor came in to find out the cause, it turned out that a tiny nick in a PEX line above the living room ceiling had been dripping for nearly two years. Water was running across the ceiling and then down the wall and eventually soaked through. They had quite the mess to get cleaned up; just because of some carelessness.

I've been wondering since I left there this afternoon whether if I'd had an IR camera at the time of that inspection I would have been able to spot a leak that small.

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike

[John Kogel]

There's a ton of PEX around here. Most installs I see are decent. The nicks that Nolan talks about are important though. Went back today to do a preventive maintenance inspection on a house that I did for a client nearly three years ago. He told me that nearly two years into the house they noticed a wall was damp. When a contractor came in to find out the cause, it turned out that a tiny nick in a PEX line above the living room ceiling had been dripping for nearly two years. Water was running across the ceiling and then down the wall and eventually soaked through. They had quite the mess to get cleaned up; just because of some carelessness.

I've been wondering since I left there this afternoon whether if I'd had an IR camera at the time of that inspection I would have been able to spot a leak that small.

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike

OK, what if you had had the IR camera and you scanned a few places around the house, but didn't happen to point it at that spot. What would your excuse be?

The IR scan of a house should be more money for a lot more time spent inspecting, IMO.

[hausdok]

Hi,

Well, I don't like to make excuses. An excuse takes away one's right to fail. I prefer explanations. I'd explain it the same way that I would with the moisture meter I use now; I'd just tell them that I hadn't scanned that area. Since those things are also digital cameras, I'd keep a separate photo record of everything I scan with the thing as a pemanent record to prove that I hadn't scanned a particular area.

Don't disagree with the premise of more money for more time spent; that's part of my motivation for considering the technology. I'm in tech central here; most of my clients are young techies that love this kind of crap and are apparently willing to pay extra for it, based on what I've been hearing about those who use these devices.

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike

[Scottpat]

One of the largest problems I find with PEX installs is that it is installed taut with little room for movement. Next would be poor support of the pipe. Seldom do I find it installed to the manufacturers specs.

[John Kogel]

Hi,

Well, I don't like to make excuses. An excuse takes away one's right to fail. I prefer explanations. I'd explain it the same way that I would with the moisture meter I use now; I'd just tell them that I hadn't scanned that area. Since those things are also digital cameras, I'd keep a separate photo record of everything I scan with the thing as a pemanent record to prove that I hadn't scanned a particular area.

Don't disagree with the premise of more money for more time spent; that's part of my motivation for considering the technology. I'm in tech central here; most of my clients are young techies that love this kind of crap and are apparently willing to pay extra for it, based on what I've been hearing about those who use these devices.

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike

Right. At this point, my reason, not excuse [], for not using IR is that it would raise the cost of an inspection beyond what the average client wants to pay. The trouble with having it as an optional add-on is that it will take that much longer to cover the expense of the tool and training. Whatever. With TV inspector Mike strutting around with his IR camera now, it's going to be hard not to have IR as an optional service in the future.

PEX pipe - How about these cheesy black plastic clamps I see everywhere?

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