DLRambo

Kurt - Its 10:00 PM Kansas time. I've clicked on the link on your message site about 5 times over the past 30 minutes and just got messages each time telling me they can't find a site called www.kurtmitenbuler.com Is that my browser or your site?? Dan Bowers

Obviously we'd all be just guessing, so what did the Professional Electrician that is repairing it say caused it when you showed him the photo.

There are literally dozens of tools I like to have or want to have with me - but if you took everything else away from me, what can I do 90% of all home inspections with by themselves? (1) My very bright flashlight (2) My Little Giant ladder (3) My 6-in-1 screwdriver (4) My GFCI tester (5) My inspection mirror (6) Field checklist or cheatsheets (7) Ballpoint Pen That is my emergency kit. Dan Bowers

Youse guys are just plain silly and wasteful at that. Every good roofer in my area knows what bubblegum is really used for (wasting good duct tape and caulk - you ought to be ashamed). Dan Bowers (KC)

Look in your code books - romex is not approved to be connected to a plug. Dan Bowers

New twist in Kansas City this week. Just met 2 young men that have been hired by mortgage brokers (or mortgage lenders???). They've been sent to a HI school for the purpose of the lender offering a "Special Deal Package" to the folks applying for real estate loans with them. Take their "Special Package" and (1) you don't owe any money till closing; (2) you get a discount on the various services; and (3) they will line up everything for you so you don't waste your valuable time dealing with folks like us. The lenders "Special Package" is the loan, the appraisal, the termite inspection, the home inspection and I've been told - several other services like title insurance, property insurance, etc. One call does it all. If 1 lender is starting to do this I wonder if others will follow. Dan Bowers

I know Norm is one of the good guys. My post is called your leg #101. Ken Young and I served together on a National HI Groups BOD for several years and saw eye to eye on most everything Norm said. Ken just had a more tactful or diplomatic way of saying it than I. Whats pathetic about my post is I keep seeing more and more of our HI's go that way. Dan Bowers

I read Norm Sages fantastic marketing article (I think he called it Itegral Decline or something like that)and got a whole bunch of great ideas on how to market to the local realestators. Man you guys in South Florida really know how to do it right. Several things did confuse me however - what in the world could someone be looking at in a 2500 sf house to keep them there 3 hours - I think 35 to 45 minutes must be the norm around here from what the "Used House Commissioned Sales People" tell me. The other thing is how could some supposed expert come up with $200,000 worth of defects in a house. Everyone knows that those type of comments would be alarming to a buyer. Please remember the point of a home inspection is to make our STAKEHOLDERS feel they've had a warm & fuzzy experience. Dan Bowers (KC) P.S. Norm we talked about that tape before - is it ready to air yet??

Maybe I didn't make the point clear enough - everything in a house does not need repair right now. Example: (1) The paint has started to get a little thin and will need painting in the near future - monitor this condition. (2) The ridge caps have started to crack, monitor them in the future - if the surface cracks don't keep going, no repair is needed in my opinion (you've got a wrinkle on your brow - should you get a facelift because of that). (3) The ridge caps are split open all the way through down to the black felt felt below - repair or replacement is needed at this time. Dan Bowers (KC)

For 26 years, I've used a fairly simple test. Is it right or wrong, as it is right now?? Do I like you well enough to want to back and pay for a new one if this WHATEVER GOES FLOP IN THE NIGHT or someone else points it out to you? If the answer to either question is NO - I report it. Reporting it does not always have to be a REPAIR. It can be a simple statement like: "We noted that some of the composition shingle ridge caps are starting to split. In our opinion no repair is needed at this time, but we suggest monitoring them on an ongoing basis. If the shingles or their condition deteriorates repairs may be needed". Dan Bowers, CRI

Lets All Sing Along To That Old Mickey Mouse Jingle - Hi Ho, Hi, Ho - Its off to kill another real estate deal I go. Dan

Guys - Are we all playing off the same page or what. I got my packet yesterday and it said Members pay $250 and ce's pay $50. It offered to let me pay in 2 installments if I wanted and said something that if my additional dues were not forthcoming by a certain date, I would be placed on administrative suspension or something like that. It also said that according to Federal Law they were notifying us that the portion of our dues going to LOBBYING EFFORTs in 2003-2004 was 3%. That does not exactly sound like what a few of you are describing that you got or am I looney? Dan Bowers, CRI

I saw the new HASHI web site yesterday. It looks neat. I'm on DSL and its slower than my old dial up was 2 years ago. I saw at least 1 candidate I trained 4 months ago on there, so I'm guessing its not just C2 candidates but anybody. I'm still trying to figure out why if members and c2's are both on it, why a member would pay $250 and a c2 pay $50. It does not differentiate between a c2 with 90 days experience and a full member. I figure this will eventually harm all ASHI members. They sent me a pledge of allegiance that among other issues has a hold ASHI harmless clause if this harms your business in any way. Humn!!!!! We used to get a fair amount of hits off the ASHI web site until we got over 140 ASHI members and c2's in a 40-50 mile circle. Now we get a hit every 3 months or so. Nobodys gonna wade through 80-140 names. We joined NAHI several years ago because their Standards were a little better written and easier for the client to understand (thats what most of the attendees in the college class I teach on construction defects said). This past year I've gotten 4-5 hits a month off the NAHI site, and its been much more productive. Dan Bowers (KC)

Anthony - Just a simple thought. Whats the best report type, whats the best marketing method, how long will it take to get a good business going, how many inspections can you do a week, what do most people complain about. Quit talking and get out there and start doing it - then you'll have those answers. What works for me or Scott or Mike will very likely not work for you. These questions are all things they should have answered for you in whatever home inspection school you attended. If you didn't go to a HI school, you should stop talking and get enrolled somewhere and do so. Dan Bowers (Kansas City)

I'm curious - why is everyone spending time trying to figure out WHY??? If its not working right, say so refer it to a competent HVAC contractor and move on. I see way to many of our guys try to diagnose a problem for a buyer or seller. If you tell them what you think is wrong and they try to correct it based on your thoughts - you've jumped into the middle of the liability loop instead of jumping out of it. Or am I reading the posts all wrong. Dan Bowers (Kansas City)

Last year I found out by accident that someone had filed a BBB complaint against us - I found this out about 6 months after the complaint was filed. The BBB apparently sent the complaint to an address we had not been at for over 3 years -why I have no idea. We had apparently been showing up for quite a while in the BBB files as UNSATISFACTORY, because of 1 unanswered complaint never received. When I found out about it I called the BBB and got a copy of the complaint. About 4 months after I had done an inspection, a single woman (school teacher) had apparently called my office and complained that 3 months after she moved in, the bath exhaust fan in the guest bath quit working and she felt we should have been able to detect that SIGNIFICANT TYPE of CONCERN. Since I had not been able to predict that breakdown she graciously offered to let us refund her home inspection fee. The office manager said thank you but no thank you. I never even heard about it - the gals in the office apparently thought she was nutsy. So she filed a BBB complaint. Lord, I love our work - you meet so many interesting people. Dan Bowers (Kansas City)

Guys: I'm old fashioned, so I charge more for almost everything except the Basic HI. My basic HI fee is just that - a fee for the basic HI on a typical house up to 1500sf. After 1500sf the cost goes up every 500sf until 4000sf. From there on its just 10 cents p/sf. That is the basic HI - what are some extra cost services? (1) If the house has a crawlspace (where I really have to get suited up and crawl); (2) If the house is over 50 years old I charge more and I have another fee if over 100 years old (I do more of these than anybody around me); (3) CO Testing with my monoxor II; (4) Floor slab level surveys with my Stanley Compu-Level (predessor to Zip Levels); (5) Moisture Analysis by probing; (6) Radon Testing; (7) Termite Inspections; ( Code Compliance; (9) Asbestos Testing; (10) Lead Based Paint Testing; (11) Mold/Air Sampling; (12) Pool Inspections; (13) Sprinkler Inspections; (14) EIFS Inspections; (15) Foundation Crack Monitoring; (16) Outbuilding if not the main garage; (17) A 2nd kitchen; (18) More than 2 copies of the report; (19) Digital photos; (20) Fed Ex or UPS if regular mail is too slow. These are a few of my added services, what I consider the fairly typical stuff. I want them to use ME because they WANT ME, not because I give them everything free. I recently saw a local franchised ASHI Inspector offering to do a HI on any house up to 3000 sf, with a Radon Test, a Termite Inspection, offering a free 90 day warranty, a free CO Test, a free TIFF-8800 check on the gas lines; a free home maintenance video, and using a computerized report with digital photos - all for $310. I'm sure he's popular with some realestators wanting to get "a really good deal" for their buyers. Thats not my style - OLD GUY ETHIC - Do Less, Make More. Let newbies do lots of the smaller houses with higher liability. Dan Bowers, CRI

Kurt - Can't you get a really neat cartoon character like the other guys, instead of that old Lon Chaney photo of the Werewolf. My poor Rottweiler was laying on the floor by the computer the last time I fired it up and he saw that has been whimpering ever since. Dan Bowers (Kansas City)

Kurt - Since I first started inspecting part-time in Texas in 1976, while still a Project Manager for a 5,000 house a year home builder - I'm more familiar with their Standards & Forms than I'd really like to be. The 1st 5 years I did HI's we checked Oven Temperatures - Don't have any reason or desire to do that again. Yes they've got some silly things like that in their Standards, but so does the big "A" (like checking counter-tops) - - but Texas also has some really good things for consumer protection, like making it mandatory that HI's call certain things defective and "In Need of Repair" like no GFCI's, or improperly installed water heaters in garages. Those type issues to me are 100% different than checking oven temperatures - and beside protecting a homeowner help keep the sleezy HI from not talking about significant safety issues. Mandating E&O Insurance as part of a license law is also not in the same ballpark as Checking Oven Temperatures. Say has any of the ASHI guys heard anything about some type of possible FTC complaint against ASHI. At a HI meeting I attended last week one of the other guys from St. Louis mentioned that they'd been told by someone in their ASHI group that possibly a Northern State's AG Office (he thought it was Michigan) had written ASHI over some type of complaint he used a word like restraint trade or ??). Dan Bowers

Mike, Scott & Others: If it sounded like my shorts are bunched, I'm sorry. But although I've waved the ASHI Flag for the past 20 years, the politics over there has gotten way too much for me to tolerate or overlook. Yes the industry owes them a lot, but the past few years we've seen things come up that any intelligent person would puke over. One of these many issues is ASHI rating state licensing laws. Who is ASHI's Legislative Committee - other HI's just like us. Who is ASHI's Legislative Committee - ASHI. Does stuff like mandatory insurance make a good licensing law?? BS - I have licenses as a Lead Inspector, Septic Inspector, Septic Installer, Asbestos Inspector, Termite Inspector, HVAC Contractor, Plumbing Contractor, Home Builder and none of them have yet required INSURANCE for my licensing. Although most of us up north get queezy thinking about using a mandatory checklist like in Texas - overall their standards are more stringent where it counts than most anyone elses. For the Non-Texans out there, in Texas if you were inspecting a 60 year old house, you would be required to report an electrical outlet without a GFCI, next to a sink - as "In Need of Repair". They've got a bunch of that type of safety issues, where they don't leave it to the HI to see if he wants to call it an upgrade or not mention it at all due to the age. I call that stringent. So when I see guys getting all reved up because ASHI rated a law as good - my thoughts are - lets ask NAHI or TAREI or FABI or MAREI how they rate the laws. You think it would come out the same. Dan Bowers

As a 20 year Member of ASHI, I think most intelligent people would realize that what ASHI or the EDPHI would rate as HIGH in the State Home Inspector Licensing Laws may be slightly slanted or prejudicial. Thats like asking Ford Motors to rate customer satisfaction levels of Ford, Dodge or Chevy. Why do I have a tendency to believe that the survey might be a bitty bit lopsided. I've also noted a tendency of ASHI Inspectors to think that their Standards, their Test (including the NHIE), their Inspectors are the only competent ones in the USA. As a Trainer, as well as a actively practicing HI - BS. After 26 years in the business (with 20 years in ASHI), I've finally come to realize that ASHI is just like everybody else. A handful of real good; a handful of real bad; and a lot of mediocre - no more, no less. Dan Bowers, CRI (Kansas City)

If we're gonna be a profession instead of a trade group we've got to show the public we have an education, not just take a test like the NHIE or carry E&O Insurance. The degrees mentioned have some coursework in construction knowledge and related subjects - although most of it would be just to show we've done it. As long as someone can become a HI without getting a college education, we'll never be a true profession like engineers, architects, etc. As long as National Associations (like ASHI or others) and state licensing laws allow people without college degrees to get into the home inspection industry by just taking 50-100 hours of HI classes and take a little 200-250 question test, we're about at the same level with a "used house commissioned salesperson". I believe all HI Training Classes should be taught in Colleges. You don't see Doctors, Engineers, or Architects getting their training at a Vo-Tech school or 2 week HI schools. Lets Really Raise The Bar And Get Rid Of All The People That Aren't In The Upper Echelon Of The Socio-Economic & Educational Circles. By the way this is my new stand when licensing comes up in Kansas. Dan Bowers, CRI (and Snob I Might Add)

I agree with setting the bar up a little. I'd like to see mandatory licensing in Kansas with the following requirements. (1) A BS Degree in Civil, Structural, or Architectual Engineering or a BS in Architecture or a BS in Construction Management; (2) Mandatory Code Certification by either ICBO, BOCA or ICC as a Combination 1 & 2 Family Dwelling Inspector; (3) a minimum of 10 years VERIFIABLE Home Inspection Experience; (4) a minimum of 5,000 General Home Inspections that meet or exceed the NAHI, TAREI or ASHI Standards; (5) a field Peer Review by a 4 man committee of Senior Inspectors; and (6) mandatory passing of the Texas Home Inspectors Exam for everyone including the above people. I feel that should thin out the ranks a little. Dan Bowers, CRI Hey Dan, what's a CRI? Just kidding..... Do you really think a BS degree in the above is necessary for HI work? Having had the classes, I can't recall any of the classwork providing much of anything in the way of HI training. I like the peer review & code certified parts.

Guys - The part about "hairdressers" not doing HI's because of licensing is possibly true, but not because of licensing - if it is true, its just because one hasn't joined yet. Besides doing Home Inspections, every 2 months we put on a 12 day seminar in KC for NEWBIE's. Most of our Trainees come from other states. One of my last class had a 60 year old remodeler from Florida, a framing contractor from Arkansas, a home builder from Colorado, a licensed electrician from Illinois, a foundation contractor from Oklahoma, a retired civil engineer (P.E.) from Tennessee, a building material salesman from Texas, a code inspector from Utah or Idaho, a graphic artist from Missouri, a computer programmer from Kansas, and a lady Ph.D.(education) from Maine. The lady Ph.D kicked the guys butts so bad it wasn't even funny. Her and the graphic artist were among the 2 best Trainees I've ever seen (which includes other local Trainees and Past Graduates of ITA, AHIT (Newcomers), NIBI, the old Leonard Hawes School in Dallas, Midwest Inspectors Institute, Franchises, etc). Most of the Newbies I see or talk to in this or other states, are not going "Full-Time" into HI - with or without a licensing law where they're at. They're trying to ease into it while holding down another job (which is how 9 out of 10 of the over 10 year veteran HI's I know anywhere in the country did it too). What I'm really saying is when one of you talk about how licensing keeps out the part-timers, you're talking about wishful thinking not reality. Dan Bowers (Kansas City)

To Brian or Anybody Else Listening: The question about Doctors carrying malpractice insurance is similar to HI's carrying E&O Insurance. I'm sure many Doctors carry it for peace of mind or a good business decision - But in Missouri & Kansas they're not required to have it to get a license, Some hospitals require it to operate there - but again its not required for their license. People hear bum info some times and believe it. About a year ago on one of the ASHI Forums, I heard a young man that was instrumental in his state (of Mississippi or Alabama) in getting licensing passed tell everyone that E&O Ins. was required of most professions in his state. He then went on to list several professions, one of which was engineers. A recent HI student of mine had just moved there, so I called him to ask about that - the student of mine just laughed and said the young man in question frequently relayed info that was off base - and no he did not have to carry E&O as an engineer. Dan Bowers